kitten-kat

Oppinions On This Tool

79 posts in this topic

I like the tool and if I was still into shoeing allot of horses I would give it a try. Have to watch you don't get too aggressive and cut too much sole out.

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Call me old fashioned, but I don't like it, and prefer to use non powered traditional tools.

I also hate the way that sole is being carved out, like many traditional farriers love to do Once a horse has had his hoof mapped, and a set up trim done, the sole should seldom be touched, instead of constantly thinned

Finally have a farrier now, that I use if a horse needs to shod, as I trim my horses, but do not shoe, who actually leaves the sole alone, only touching it if a small adjustment has to be made to set the shoe

A farrier does not need to leave his mark on the entire bottom of that hoof, 'prettying' it up by carving out the sole and over trimming the frog!

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No need for it. As others said: leave the sole alone...just scrape where needed and if you have migrated bars, trim with your knife.

However, I do use an Angle Grinder for my trim work. I get a very even trim, can take off a hair's breadth where needed and it's faster/easier on both horse & my back. I can even trim bars quickly, ramping them up from sole plane to heel platform in a gentle swipe. If they're impacted or overlaid, I can switch to my Dremel tool for fine work.

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I was asked to look at a horse yesterday. It has not had regular hoof maintanance and was extremely flared and out of balance. Would require allot of work bringing the hoof back into balance and eliminating the flair. Over the years you get tired of using the knife all the time and anything to make life easier would be appreciated. The stall jack is one of those things to make life easier.

If I was still shoing on a larger scale I would give one of those a try.

Also in August when it is hot and dry the soles are extremely tough and they do require paring down to eliminate the long toe.

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Maybe a tool in the right hands, but there is a great danger in having such a devise in the hands of any in -experienced trimmer, doing his own work

Dental electric grinders have much of the same basis, far as concern. The ability for an un skilled person do do harm, is increased in both cases

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I'm giving this tool some serious thought right now. My arm strength hasn't been the same since Hero. It would be nice to be able to do more than 2 feet at one sitting.

I agree with you Smilie on the video. Wouldn't touch the sole that much and I feel he didn't begin to finish the trim on that hoof. I have a feeling that I'd be going back to the rasp to do the bevel. Maybe you have to change from the chainsaw disc to the Power Rasp to finish...so how easy is it to change the heads, or am I just going to reach for the rasp anyway?

You can move the guard, 9-23 degrees, but don't remove it entirely for safety's sake. I get that, but I've got a question into them asking whether a left handed person could use this. I can use both hands on the rasp, but for this, I'd want it in my left hand. Price is steep.

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I have reasons for asking about it....I was given one, and a hoof jack as a gift. I do my own barefoot trimming on my horses, I dont agree with the sole trimming, but the aspect of clearing bars, and the majority of the trim intrigue me, and I plan to learn to use this...

Missy, I agree with the pain, and strenth aspect, it wipes me out to trim one...let alone 2. So watching the videos, and applying a good barefoot trim technique this should help, I will see if I need apply a rasp or not....will let you know.

As for how a horse responds, it came with a very sound fox trotter gelding with little ver a years use. Will see how it goes...still wanting more oppinions.

Edited by kitten-kat

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DITTO AND YES... do not use power tools unless you've been trained and have practiced A LOT on logs....taking off minute layers of bark to learn the feel.

Missy and Kitten: For bars and true sole that must come out, use a Dremel. It's much finer and you have many more tip or head options to choose from. Also, it's much smaller so it fits your hand better for more control.

Were it not for my training in using the grinder for power trims, I couldn't do all the horses I do. Right now I'm trimming 28 horses. Only 4 are manual trims. NOTE: I do this part time to help rehab and work alongside owners who are SICK AND TIRED of lazy farrier work and the lame horses that result from it. I have a full time/Mon-Fri job as an H.R. Manager ;)

My Makita allows me to trim in 1/4th the time - easier on my back! Also I can hold the hoof in one hand, right under the horse's body, balanced and lower to the ground than up on a stand - easier for the horse and makes for a very even trim.

If physical aches & pains are getting to you, please consider getting training in Power Trims. Granted, we live a bit far apart, but the door is always open for you to come visit me.

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My Makita allows me to trim in 1/4th the time - easier on my back! Also I can hold the hoof in one hand, right under the horse's body, balanced and lower to the ground than up on a stand - easier for the horse and makes for a very even trim.

Do you have any problems with the noise from the makita?? They are extremely noisy. I have 9 of them in the shop so when one overheats I switch to another.

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Missy and Kitten: For bars and true sole that must come out, use a Dremel. It's much finer and you have many more tip or head options to choose from. Also, it's much smaller so it fits your hand better for more control.

The dremel is a little small and light weight with a poor selection of cutting tools, actually just fine grinding wheels. Die grinders while noisy have a good selection of burrs but again the noise would get to me.

I had 25 horses to keep shod year round with very few trims.

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Couldn't resist the typo this morning, KIt Kat, as it must be that endless winter in Alberta this year , that makes one try to find humor somewhere!

I don't know about horses, but lots of people could use their 'souls' trimmed!

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:) stupid kindle correct......

Ive never been a person for trimming sole accept what needs come off......Ive tried a dremmel, and they are small....this has several 2 inch heads to work with, and Many more to order...yes you can flip the guard left and right handed. And so far my wood play as it were, is pretty smooth....I really want to get tungsten carbide heads....and I am glad Im pretty good with chain saws, but the little chain head can be somewhat daunting, but "playing" with it on wood has helped with getting a feel, and it really is easy to control...

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Well, I still trim around 10 head of horses, often two at a time, and as long as I can continue to do so manually, won't fix what isn't broken!

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I wish I could...but pain levels where they are, Im for the less work part....my horses are patient with me, but the really only goes so far. It takes me about an hour to trim a horse...I have incorporated a very small stool to help, and I have my car jack stand hoof jack, it has done well for me. But having the hoof jack will make an interesting practice, wider base, more stability.

I cant wait to start working with it on the boys....will post results.

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Do you have any problems with the noise from the makita?? They are extremely noisy. I have 9 of them in the shop so when one overheats I switch to another.

Very rarely. Case in point: I was asked to trim a Westfalen Stallion this past Saturday. I'd never met the owner or the horse. I explained to the owner that we'd try the grinder and see how he does. If he freaked, no biggie... I'd use my rasp, but that most horses, when desensitized properly, have no issue.

I begin by turning it on and off quickly and watch their reaction. Usually they turn an ear and look at it. Some are curious and want to smell the odd thing. I always offer shoulder scritches while they look & sniff. Then repeat the process of turning it on/off multiple times, followed by scritches or the owner gives a treat, and moving closer to them. They associate the sound with Good things. I'll pick up a hoof, turn it on/off and put the hoof down. They realize I will give them their foot back and not force them to leave it in my hands. When they relax, I'll pick it up again and then touch the grinder to the hoof quickly, turn it off and give them their hoof back again. Repeat as needed until I can proceed with the trim. Most take only one to two quick touches and I have at it.

I repeat this process on each side.

This stallion did great. He had a few moments of "Wow lady, that tickles!" but I let him have his foot back, let him settle, offered scritches and waited for licking/chewing and softening of the eye or dropping of the head before going back at it again. He was trimmed in 25 minutes.

Edited by Chocomare

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:) stupid kindle correct......

Ive never been a person for trimming sole accept what needs come off.....

You can't back a toe up without cutting sole . Any horse with neglected feet are also most likely out of balance thus another heavy sole trim.

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..Ive been trimmng since I was 15. But really learned 8-9 years ago....mostly from the awesome people here who take the time to look at pictures and offer up good sound advice. Ive enjoyed the technique so many here have shown me. And my club footed gelding is sound and happy from these..... Ive trimmed a lot of horses over the years, just upgrading my tools....

Edited by kitten-kat

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I like your tool and if I was still in business I would buy one but I have retired and restrict my shoeing to my own and a select few. Just not worth the investment at my age but I would go for it if I was younger.

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Well after taking some time to use the tool yesterday with all 3 of the horses in my care, I'll say all 3 took to it easy, 1 is already used to it, so that made it easy on me. The other 2 didnt even care...I did use the rasp to make everything smooth. But really didnt have too....it really was easy to use to clear knife dulling bars, and nice to get the walls to where I wanted, and as for cleaning nasty false sole, really nice..I dont like touching the sole, but when it is trapping smelly bacteria and flakes off easy with the hoof pick I will usually remove it to allow the foot to get rid of the bacteria easier. BTW did I mention it made what usually takes me an hour a horse, go in half an hour each....and Daniels very hard to cut bars and walls were like putty...

If you push too hard on this thing (experamented with cherry wood to see....) it will stop, not dig deeper....you can take the lightest touch with it and take paper thin slices that allow one to take their time, and only what is needed... I really like this I was dissaponted in the guard though, after 3 hooves it started rattling liise, so I removed it...going right to left hand really doesnt work unless your REALLY good and steady with both..I found I used my right hand more than my left....it is easy to rest your hand in the middle if the foot and arc the tool aroung the walls to shorten and get 90% of the bevel done, then finish withe rasp.

Very easy for me to get used to.... I wouldnt mind seeing what a 4 inch angle grinder might do someday, but my hands hurt, and this didnt hurt them.

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You can't back a toe up without cutting sole . Any horse with neglected feet are also most likely out of balance thus another heavy sole trim.

Not true exactly, unless that sole has a lot of false sole.

You have to obey live sole in backing up a toe, letting sole concavity and depth build

Here is an artical you will find that goes into toe length, sole depth, etc, and how to back that toe up over time, without thinning the sole

http://www.hoofrehab.com/Coronet.html

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jUst alittle section of that artical

There are countless factors that affect toe length and heel height. Sensitive and underdeveloped lateral cartilages and digital cushions may cause a need for a higher heel, as may ligament, tendon, joint and muscular issues. Flared or rotated toe walls can dramatically effect toe length measurements. The list goes on and on.

But with all the "if's, an's and but's" we have to sort through every day, at least one thing is consistent. It is simply never desirable to thin the soles beyond their natural thickness. The left photo shows the naturally thick and uniform sole of a healthy horse. The other three (red lines) show very common mistakes I see every day. How is it even possible for a professional to do this? A vast majority of professionals were trained to place top priority in heel and toe wall lengths/angles; sacrificing the sole thickness. Many barefoot trimmers will cut into or near the corium trying to shorten heel walls heels. Many farriers will routinely take much needed sole from the toe, trying to shorten the toe walls or raise toe angles. I hope this article makes this a little less common.

100_3270.JPGcoronet1.jpgcoronet2.jpgcoronet3.jpg

Burn these pictures into your brain and every time you see the sole being trimmed, always ask yourself which of the four pictures is most similar to the end result.

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You get a foot like this and you have to cut toe, cut sole around the toe to back it up and get a better angle

2di4wsn.jpg

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Those heels are under run. You need to map that foot, get the break over back, and back the toe up from the top

k%20richert%202.jpg

l%20richert%202.jpg

Forget the toes, imagine what it feels like to have your heels in the center of your foot. P3 is at ground level at start.

10 weeks and comfortable throughout "transition" without touching the sole under P3, which was already too thin

This is a "runaway hoof" at its worse. The list of future problems you can prevent with a little natural care is long and frightening! This is the main thing I want to get across to farriers. Even if you refuse to give up your shoes, can't you see the benefit of learning to do THIS during a 2-3 month "barefoot period"? (Below; six more months)

rehabi12.jpg

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Dubbing off that toe, removing sole is going to do nothing , far as the pathology of that foot posted, DR650.

Believe me I know, as I had a farrier do that to my gelding, who was prone to long toe/under run heels. He would just dub off that toe, using nippers, cutting wall and sole. Yup, with shoes he remained sound for many years, but the failure to get those heels back under him, have him landing comfortably heel first, eventually caused him to go lame. That was my first introduction to barefoot re habilitation, studying the works of people such as Dr Robert Bowker, taking hoof trimming clinics from someone that worked with Pete Ramey, then lately taking an ELPO hoof mapping clinic, and continuing to learn what Dr Bowker calls the physiological trim

My gelding was brought back from needing to be put down, to being pasture sound, and sound enough for my grandson to ride. Some of the pathology just did some permanent damage over the years. It was too late to completely help my gelding, but believe me I have studied and learned a lot since. There is only one traditional farrier around here (and Alberta has many ) ,l that I will allow to shoe my horses, when, and if they need shoes

Dr Stephan O Grady, himself, who is both a vet and a farrier and works on hoof pathology (equine podiatry ), readily states that bad farrier work is the number one cause of lameness in horses

He is certainly not anti shoing,as he uses corrective shoing in many of his cases, But he also has the background and has worked on enough horses that developed soundness problems directly from they way they were shod Have a poor trim, and shoes lock in that pathology

On the foot you posted, I would pull shoes and do some progressive hoof re rehabilitation trims, getting those heels back under the horse, the toe backed up , and work on that negative palmer angle of that dubbed toe

Look how the support of the back of that horse's foot has migrated forward, . Looks like maybe a bit of heel wedging was even attempted, and the toe just dubbed. Won't fix what is wrong in the least!

Edited by Smilie

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some of our horse's this quarter horse included could not be used without shoes. My arab with good feet needs shoes. Aluminum shoes last a week and barefoot he wears a foot out in short order so again shoes are required. Any hard working horse needs shoes for wear purposes.

this quarter horse came to the barn and this is after the 1st shoing, the next day when I brought my wife's camera. The next time it would have improved again.

bijw3q.jpg

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smilie you can't get nothing for nothing. If you want to shorten the toe you need to cut sole. How do you take a 4 1/2 inch toe and shorten it to 4 without going into the sole???

Rolling a foot over from say 45 degrees to try for about 54 you need to cut the foot , the sole at the toe and taper it back.

Under run heals need to be shortened to strengthen them.

I try barefoot all the time but before long I notice him watching his step, not as confident as with shoes and the extreme wear and on go the shoes again.

2dbmr6e.jpg

Edited by DR650

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