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Cow Bred V.S. Race Bred


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#1 Pep's_Gone_Wild09

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 09:17 PM

Okay I know alot of ppl like to cross cow bred to the racing bred horses. It gives the foals larger joints, ect.
but if you were buying a new horse and had it narrowed down to either a cow bred horse or a race bred horse who would you choose. Now most of you would be like, well it depends on the horse, but between both, what would you choose?
My mare Pepper is a cow bred and is very athletic, her son is the grandson of Blondy's Dude, and he looks like he'll be a great horse, hopefully a barrel horse. Then Bailey who is race bred is going to be fast, she is fast loping the pattern. So which would you choose, a cow bred or race bred?

#2 Vegas By Storm

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 09:23 PM

Cow, Vegas is cow bred, no running in him.

#3 razzberry

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 09:28 PM

Cowbred! Atletic horses with intellegence. Not total run to them but they seem to really think stuff out. [Wink]

#4 Pep's_Gone_Wild09

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 09:52 PM

I was really curious to see what ya'll thought. Pepper is cow bred and a tremedious athlete. Don't get me wrong Bailey (race bred) is a nice athlete too, its just she doesn't have the.... ummmm......POW that Pepper has to turn a barrel. I do think when I run Bailey she'll be a great barrel horse.

#5 LilCanChaser12

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 10:08 PM

I dont think thats a fair question [Smile]

All cow bred--- a lot of them are broncy and stubborn

all run-- a lot of them are hott and blow by barrels

#6 nycowboy17

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 10:20 PM

no doubt about it, cow bred.

Cow bred horses are just as athletic and sometimes more than running bred horses. I think that they're built better and have better minds. I have a huge list of reasons but i'm having a lazy night so i won't type them here.

Also, Mesa Leavitt's horse Jo Lena Doc aka San Jo is a cow bred horse and i would like to see anybody here outrun that horse.

#7 TeamPenningTeen

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 10:56 PM

I would pick a cow bred horse any day of the week

#8 zipper

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 11:40 PM

quote:
Originally posted by nycowboy17:


Also, Mesa Leavitt's horse Jo Lena Doc aka San Jo is a cow bred horse and i would like to see anybody here outrun that horse.

Having made my living reporting on the barrel racing industry for the past 10 years, I can honestly say that if not for a lightweight rider you never would have heard of Jo Lena Doc in the national barrel racing press. He was a nice horse for the gal that sold him to the Levitts, but he wasn't a world beater until he got a pint-sized pixie on his back.

I can also say if you look at any results from futurities to rodeos you will see more straight racebreds or run/cow cross than straight cowbred running at the top of the pack.

There are a handful of great cowbred horses out there, but they're now in the minority. You see more of them in the lower divisions because of their mind and they're use friend for barrel racing neophytes and super seasoned campaginers (ie senior riders).

If you've never trained a barrel horse before from scratch a cow bred horse might be the way to go, but barrel racers have found the right mix of racehorse bloodlines that make great barrel horses and they're pretty tough to beat.

Look at the NFR, only one horse was what I would call cow-bred Tana Poppino's Perrymans Star, a double-bred Doc Bar way back in the wood pile. Even Brandie Halls set an arena record on a horse that is old run/performance lines that not many would consider "cow" lines, but I do know he's pretty cowy generally speaking. (He's a wicked heading horse.) Everything else was straight run including the top three horses in the world or barrel bred (run/cow cross -- DJ Nick Bar and Frosty Feelins)

Remember too a running bred horse can be trained to have snappy turns, but you can't make a cow horse run any faster than their legs can carry them.

#9 1-4-U

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Posted 17 January 2007 - 11:45 PM

I like a mix of 50/50 myself.

#10 Dash For Desire

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 01:34 AM

I would really have to go with Race bred horses. I have owned both race bred and cow bred horses.

The Cowbred mare, Fancey(Skipper W) that I owned was strictly cow, And she definately was fast but once I put her on the barrels she did not have the heart that I needed for it. Put her behind a cow and she would give it her all.

My 3 racebred horses(that were papered), Snickers(Jet Deck, Azure Te, Go Man Go), Dina(Dash For Cash) and Alibi(Streakin Six, Raise Your Glass), you showed them the pattern and they stuck to it. They had it down and gave me 110% each time. That's just my experience with it and they all made awesome barrel horses.

I say, go with the racebred horses. [Smile]

#11 barrelracer17

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 02:39 AM

Cow-bred.

1) Because I also rope and having a cowy horse is kinda handy when you're roping cattle.
2) Cow-horses really HUNT the barrel. They really get into it and they're usually pretty quick and smart with a good mind.

=)

#12 barrelracer17

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 02:41 AM

Although, my 26 year old gelding has MANY close racing lines on his papers and he LOVES the pattern. He will do anything to go as fast and you need him to. He has alot of heart.

Now I can't make up my mind. I usually associate racing-lines with being hot-headed and very spazzy, but I guess there's always a couple bad apples. I should brush up on my racing lines.

#13 DaisyTenPonies

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 07:25 AM

Race-bred hands down no question.

#14 WhizFix

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 08:13 AM

Like them both and have both, but had rather have cow bred on top crossed with a good running bred mare.

#15 luv2canchase

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 09:09 AM

I like Race Bred, b/c of the speed.
But cow bred can work on there feet better.
I like both, all of our horses are cowy besides for Doc and April and they both are running.

[Smile] Courtney

#16 I_cowgrl_up

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 09:57 AM

quote:
Originally posted by 1-4-U:
I like a mix of 50/50 myself.

Ditto. My horse is Special Effort on top and Otoe's Wonder on bottom...I absolutely LOVE my horse!!!!!

but if i just had to choose one or the other, i really don't know. i love cow bred horses, great minds, but i might would choose a running bred...i like a little challenge now and then. I think it's great fun working with one that's a little hyper and get him to slow work. i feel like i've accomplished something as oposed to one who "knew it all along" (cow bred). i like them both but prefere 50/50 over all.

#17 sassymassy

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 12:07 PM

Race bred, any day of the week. You can teach a race horse to do anything a cow horse can do. When a race horse comes off the track they are really high because of the feed/meds they have been on. It takes a while for them to come down off that "high". But they all will.

Having watched some of this year's futurity horses, there is NO way a cow horse could compete with them. This is probably the toughest bunch of young horses I've ever seen. Looking at the results, no cow horses have really placed anywhere. Even at the futurities, the futurity horses (that are all race bred) are outrunning the open horses. That speaks volumes to me.

It's not been until the last 5-10 years that people have really started breeding for run and turn. You can get a strong race bred horse that was intended to be a barrel horse.

I'm not saying that a cow horse can't come along and be competitive, but they are by far the minority today. In the next 10 years they might be obsolete in the upper divisions at the big races.

I could not agree with Zipper more. You can teach a race horse to snap a barrel but you can't teach a cow horse to run faster. I had never heard of Jo Lena Doc until a 70 pound rider ran it. Put a 150 pound person on that horse and it becomes a 3D horse.

#18 Guest__*

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 01:07 PM

Sassymorgan, I think your record is skipping [ROTFL] !!!

If I had to choose it would depend on how far I wanted to go with my horse. If it was local/state/provincial and for bombing around the farm, it would be cow horse.

If I wanted to go pro right to the top, it would be running..if I had to pick one or the other

I have a 50/50 My guy is halter/cutting on the top, great grandson to mardelle dixon and redeemer. On the bottom he is running, great grandson to Jet Deck and Beduino. he is 5, so far so good.

#19 sassymassy

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 01:30 PM

quote:
Originally posted by r's easy jet:
Sassymorgan, I think your record is skipping [ROTFL] !!!


Oops... Sorry about that. I have deleted the extras [Wink]

#20 Bumper

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 01:31 PM

quote:
Originally posted by zipper:
quote:
Originally posted by nycowboy17:


Also, Mesa Leavitt's horse Jo Lena Doc aka San Jo is a cow bred horse and i would like to see anybody here outrun that horse.

Having made my living reporting on the barrel racing industry for the past 10 years, I can honestly say that if not for a lightweight rider you never would have heard of Jo Lena Doc in the national barrel racing press. He was a nice horse for the gal that sold him to the Levitts, but he wasn't a world beater until he got a pint-sized pixie on his back.

I can also say if you look at any results from futurities to rodeos you will see more straight racebreds or run/cow cross than straight cowbred running at the top of the pack.

There are a handful of great cowbred horses out there, but they're now in the minority. You see more of them in the lower divisions because of their mind and they're use friend for barrel racing neophytes and super seasoned campaginers (ie senior riders).

If you've never trained a barrel horse before from scratch a cow bred horse might be the way to go, but barrel racers have found the right mix of racehorse bloodlines that make great barrel horses and they're pretty tough to beat.

Look at the NFR, only one horse was what I would call cow-bred Tana Poppino's Perrymans Star, a double-bred Doc Bar way back in the wood pile. Even Brandie Halls set an arena record on a horse that is old run/performance lines that not many would consider "cow" lines, but I do know he's pretty cowy generally speaking. (He's a wicked heading horse.) Everything else was straight run including the top three horses in the world or barrel bred (run/cow cross -- DJ Nick Bar and Frosty Feelins)

Remember too a running bred horse can be trained to have snappy turns, but you can't make a cow horse run any faster than their legs can carry them.

[Not Worthy] [Not Worthy]

Very well said.

I've always been a fan of cowbred horses. I'd never turn down a good horse simply because he was all cowbred. That said, i doubt i'll ever buy a strictly cowbred barrel horse again.

My new filly is all run. Bought her off the track in OK from friends of mine. My friend has a half sister to this filly plus several others bred to run. Her gelding is being roped off of now and her stud spent time in Canada moving cows, roping, etc. Just because a horse has running blood doesn't mean they can't be cowy or be big enough and built to rope.

My filly is 15.2 as a coming three yr old. Her sire has thrown some AWESOME roping horses. he was 15.2 or 3 and STOUT as ****. Speed does not equal "no cow".

As far as that goes, cow doesn't mean no speed. I"ve seen some cow bred horses who could give any speed horse a run for their money for 100 yrds or so. BUT in general, a speed horse will out run a cow horse and a cow horse will "out cow" a speed horse. There's a reason. It's called "breeding". [Wink]

My choice 10 yrs ago? Cow horse? My choice now? Run.

HTTY & GBTUSA

BUMPER

#21 Team Penner07

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 05:25 PM

My horse is running bred mostly, he has a little bit of cow horse in him, and I would choose a cow bred horse any day. They have so much more talent I think, they can stop and turn with so much more grace.

#22 cuz

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 07:20 PM

Both
How's that for sitting the fence. LOL

#23 NickAqh

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 07:23 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Bumper:
quote:
Originally posted by zipper:
quote:
Originally posted by nycowboy17:


Also, Mesa Leavitt's horse Jo Lena Doc aka San Jo is a cow bred horse and i would like to see anybody here outrun that horse.

Having made my living reporting on the barrel racing industry for the past 10 years, I can honestly say that if not for a lightweight rider you never would have heard of Jo Lena Doc in the national barrel racing press. He was a nice horse for the gal that sold him to the Levitts, but he wasn't a world beater until he got a pint-sized pixie on his back.

I can also say if you look at any results from futurities to rodeos you will see more straight racebreds or run/cow cross than straight cowbred running at the top of the pack.

There are a handful of great cowbred horses out there, but they're now in the minority. You see more of them in the lower divisions because of their mind and they're use friend for barrel racing neophytes and super seasoned campaginers (ie senior riders).

If you've never trained a barrel horse before from scratch a cow bred horse might be the way to go, but barrel racers have found the right mix of racehorse bloodlines that make great barrel horses and they're pretty tough to beat.

Look at the NFR, only one horse was what I would call cow-bred Tana Poppino's Perrymans Star, a double-bred Doc Bar way back in the wood pile. Even Brandie Halls set an arena record on a horse that is old run/performance lines that not many would consider "cow" lines, but I do know he's pretty cowy generally speaking. (He's a wicked heading horse.) Everything else was straight run including the top three horses in the world or barrel bred (run/cow cross -- DJ Nick Bar and Frosty Feelins)

Remember too a running bred horse can be trained to have snappy turns, but you can't make a cow horse run any faster than their legs can carry them.

[Not Worthy] [Not Worthy]

Very well said.

I've always been a fan of cowbred horses. I'd never turn down a good horse simply because he was all cowbred. That said, i doubt i'll ever buy a strictly cowbred barrel horse again.

My new filly is all run. Bought her off the track in OK from friends of mine. My friend has a half sister to this filly plus several others bred to run. Her gelding is being roped off of now and her stud spent time in Canada moving cows, roping, etc. Just because a horse has running blood doesn't mean they can't be cowy or be big enough and built to rope.

My filly is 15.2 as a coming three yr old. Her sire has thrown some AWESOME roping horses. he was 15.2 or 3 and STOUT as ****. Speed does not equal "no cow".

As far as that goes, cow doesn't mean no speed. I"ve seen some cow bred horses who could give any speed horse a run for their money for 100 yrds or so. BUT in general, a speed horse will out run a cow horse and a cow horse will "out cow" a speed horse. There's a reason. It's called "breeding". [Wink]

My choice 10 yrs ago? Cow horse? My choice now? Run.

HTTY & GBTUSA

BUMPER

Hey ya Bump!! How the heck are ya? I'm a fan of straight race bred horses, but I'm not a barrel racer, I'm more of a race horse guy.. lol I'll tell ya though.. Watch out for the Corona Cartels in the Barrel pen in a few years.. Majority of them will be by Sons of Corona Cartel, because CC Syndicate Members arent going to waste their shares on breeding for barrel horses.. Those things do have some brains and most of them will outrun about anything.

#24 Pep's_Gone_Wild09

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Posted 18 January 2007 - 07:26 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Team Penner07:
My horse is running bred mostly, he has a little bit of cow horse in him, and I would choose a cow bred horse any day. They have so much more talent I think, they can stop and turn with so much more grace.

Okay you said that perfect... Thats what I atleast tried to say about Pepper [Big Grin]
Now don't get me wrong Bailey will be a very good barrel horse but she just isn't graceful as Pepper.

#25 In Pursuit of Perfection

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Posted 19 January 2007 - 09:14 AM

Tough one to say, I would have to say it all depends on the horse. I have a preference, thats 50/50.

If I am looking at older horses, I am going to buy the horse for the horse not for the papers.

I have seen cow horses who cant run, some who can. Run who cant and run who sure can.

I think what is most important is looking at the agility and mind.

My good mare Dottie was all cow but could clock at the top, same with my paint gelding Dodge, he is pretty much cow. But... my mare Lexus is 50/50 and man do I like having that bottom end speed, as well as my new prospect... he is an own son of DFP but he is foundation bred on the bottom.

I dont have an answer... look at the horse before you look at the papers.

#26 Belles3838

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Posted 19 January 2007 - 11:01 AM

I currently run a cowbred horse. She can blow the third barrel and run the arena fence line and win the 1D. Cowbred doesn't make them slow. I live in Florida and run against a lot of the top barrel racers in Florida and Georgia. I'm breeding her this year and everyone is telling me to breed her to a cowbred stallion because they think she's all run.
I would definately go with the cowbred.

#27 Belles3838

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Posted 19 January 2007 - 11:02 AM

Oh I forgot to add my mare is APHA. Talk about going against the odds. She's registered cow bred paint that can run.

#28 Three*C*Champs

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Posted 19 January 2007 - 11:51 AM

Hmm...I think Cowboy's both. On his maternal side he's Tiny's Gay & Merridoc. On his dad's side....nope he's a bunch of racing Paints...I guess all racebred [Confused]

Kirby is the same Paint racing lines on his Maternal side, but Sonny Dee Bar on his Paternal side. Again [Confused]

I love em' both [Big Grin]

#29 LilCanChaser12

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Posted 19 January 2007 - 11:59 AM

quote:
Originally posted by In Pursuit of Perfection:
Tough one to say, I would have to say it all depends on the horse. I have a preference, thats 50/50.

If I am looking at older horses, I am going to buy the horse for the horse not for the papers.

I have seen cow horses who cant run, some who can. Run who cant and run who sure can.

I think what is most important is looking at the agility and mind.

My good mare Dottie was all cow but could clock at the top, same with my paint gelding Dodge, he is pretty much cow. But... my mare Lexus is 50/50 and man do I like having that bottom end speed, as well as my new prospect... he is an own son of DFP but he is foundation bred on the bottom.

I dont have an answer... look at the horse before you look at the papers.

I have an own sonof DFP as well. what is your bottom side look like? just curious this is my first DFP and LOVE him.. he's amazing, very athletic, smart, fast learner and great mind.

#30 Me and Dan-D Canchasin

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Posted 19 January 2007 - 12:06 PM

I have a mix of all, but honestly can't say I like any of them any better than the next. They all have different perks and downfalls that make them good. I love mine to be sensible and athletic which honestly all depends on the horse in general not the bloodlines.

My two competition horses are a Thoroughbred and the other is 1/4 Thoroughbred and 3/4 Quarter Horse. So I have a race bred and a 50/50. My prospect is also 50/50.

[ 01-19-2007, 12:11 PM: Message edited by: Me and Dan-D Canchasin ]