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Everything posted by missyclare

  1. Starting To Become Desperate! Pictures & Video

    An excellent post Trimity, with links for better help. My first thought was patience. He was in a sad state of affairs when you first got him. He'd consumed much fat off his body and looks to me like he'd been standing crinched up in pain for a long time. The muscles look very flacid. I think you've handled the aspects of his recovery beautifully so far. Patience, I see improvement already, as I know you have. When a horse is in this condition, the thoughts of his feet are last in line with recovery. He has more important issues body-wise that needs his attention first. You are getting the nutrition into him and he is improving. He's using that nutrition to fuel the recovery to everything, but it takes time...much more time than it took him to lose it. I see the clubbiness of the foot as a resulting end of the line of pathology further on up. I do see lack of flexibility in the stifle, but am not convinced that this is the root of the problem just yet. When I look higher, I see a topline that is crinched and not working as well either and suspect that his spine is also crinched and not allowing proper movement. It hurts him to extend his foot back, so he didn't, and now the hoof is just being what it needs to be and the DDFT has contracted in response = club foot. Its very possible that the stifles are only like the foot and are a symptom of pain, that the real problem could up at the spine (sacro-illiac/ top most elevation of the rump), and forward of that, which on him is the top most elevation. Everything else is tucked into a pelvic tilt before it gets down to the stifle. Before surgery or anything drastic, I would call a chiro in for a full assessment. Pathology always has a path to it and as you follow it you will find pinch points down the line of it. Walter was moving just like this guy, only worse. I thought it was an abscess, then thought it was the stifle, then found out it was the sacro-illiac in my investigation going up that path of pathology. The 2nd visit from the chiro did the trick. With that appt. he was released and could suddenly put that leg back in stride and for him, put that hoof on the ground and start using it properly and in full stride with the other leg. Now that things were released and working properly, it was my job to do exercises to strengthen and re-educate the muscles to hold the fort properly. The chiro found him out at the sacro-illiac, out at the poll and out at the withers on the diagonal side from that foot. His whole body was a mess from crinching up in pain and that's what this horse has been through. Release first, then muscle education to keep it. I looked up the path of pathology, but the chiro helped me look farther. Once he was unlocked and allowed to move properly, the foot took care of itself. I don't agree with this shoeing. it has forced him to suddenly stretch his DDFT and is not gradual. I'm thinking this hoof should have had a shoe extension on the toe to support it. I would have lowered the heels gradually to coax comfortably, not dictate it in one complete drop. To me, there has been a drastic measure to correct the end of the line pathology when the problem is up at his spine. Release it and you get the lengthening with the pain gone and heel support to coax it in the meantime. Walter moved like this, only he was three-legged lame for 8 months, while the vet said abscess and stifle. Turns out the stifle was just one of the those pinch points along the path of pathology. So, before you think surgery etc., I would definitely urge you to call in a chiro and have a look at the whole horse. It certainly created the end of our nightmare.
  2. Princess's Hooves

    Go easy on yourself, eh? Give yourself time to heal as well. I made that mistake of getting back into it too soon and got into trouble with my 5th one. Felt fine, was just hemorrhaging and whole stomach had turned red. Had to lie down for a couple of days. Don't go there. Use a stool, a stand, only do one hoof, take it easy. There's nothing wrong with these feet that you can't work piecemeal or slowly on. Its the better way anyway. I'll need better pics, especially the heel shots that aren't as severe. I need to see the whole frog and toe in the background and let the hoof hang by one hand from the fetlock and lean forward, keeping 2 feet away. CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!
  3. Purina Bmz

    The grass, particularily, the clover, is going to be the main enemy. Depending on the sensitivity, either out there to move with a muzzle or dry lot. The best plan is not to go there in the first place. Management is going to be important. The Formula For Feet still makes my eyebrows go up. The arginine is a plus and has low iron. Sure is expensive. I like Trinity's too, but higher in iron. Iron is also a main player to watch for and avoid. Iron always comes in store bought feed. So, if you want to avoid iron, Smilie's suggestion does and probably at half the cost. California Trace is another good one, and a good one to compare with others for content. Its expensive too, but all you really need if you're not in trouble with the management. Both the California Trace and Formula For Feet are low in iron. You could also try Uckele, another excellent place to be.
  4. Purina Bmz

    If he is on grass, he doesn't need a vitamin/mineral supplement, but if on a hay only diet, he needs 1000IU of Vit.E/day. (2IU/lb of body weight) Most people usually buy seaweed for the iodine. There is a little bit of everything in there....little bit. The copper has anywhere from 4-15ppm Cu, which means .1134mg/oz to .43mg/oz. (negligible) This is what is delivered in 1oz. of product, but you're feeding 1tbn., so its anyone's guess as to how much is being delivered on any given day. 2000ppm of Vitamin C is not needed. Only for those that are ill or under stress and only temporarily to get them over the hump. Vit C. enhances iron absorption....not good. Along with the baddie of Iron, arsenic, cadmium, tin, lead, nickel etc. are also in it. These things are a part of daily life and are bad, so why elect to feed them? May be a overdose of iodine, which these products are famous for. 4.9g in the probiotics and a horse requires 3.5mg/day and iodine can get toxic, just like selenium. The copper in the seaweed is .43mg/oz and you are feeding 1tbn. so I'm thinking, negligible. The range at which any of these things are delivered in the seaweed is great, no pinning this down. Wonder what the source is.This is very important with this kind of product. Speaking of Source, one of the best ones, the iodine in it is also toxic and it has been recommended by other than the company that no more than 1tsp. should be fed due to toxic iodine. The feeding directions on the Source are incorrect and still are....still don't get it. Daily needs are 3.5mg/day and yours puts you at 4.9/day. So, the seaweed is negligible with some nasties included. The Probiotics are low in iron, copper and zinc have met needs and are balanced at 2.8:1, which is a little lean, but ok. Manganese is low and the balance is off, on all 4 traces, but anything goes because the hay hasn't been tested. These minerals interact with each other and must be balanced. Simply meeting needs does not cut it. If it were me, I'd lose them both and go with this one...perfect for selenium, iodine, copper, zinc, biotin, A, E,methionine and lysine. No need to add any more with this one. The biotin in this one also meets daily requirements dead on as well. Note the amount being delivered. You don't see this very often. A vitamin/mineral supplement is not needed either, only E on hay only, sometimes A and C to help with things. Otherwise, he manufactures his own vitamins. As for probiotics, they should be in the "billions" to be effective. Ration Plus or yeast. 10 min/day of sunshine give him his daily Vitamin D, just like us. http://www.californiatrace.com/ingredients.html Hope this helps to make life simpler and better..
  5. Sole Calous

    It's about the balance in the trim. The quarters are high and need to be cleared. The left heel needs to come down more than I have shown, but enough for now. The bar on that side also looks to be high. Between the two of them its pushing outward from the back on the lateral side. If you have removed all the false sole, the hoof could have lost integrity and swayed. Follow the sole and don't touch it. It looks like you have trimmed what the gauge has dictated and more work with your eye and what the hoof is telling you is needed and just using the gauge now and then to check up on things. Boots with padding would help to develop the back of the foot and that's where your strength is.
  6. Sole Calous

    The gauge looks like its been helpful, but you also need to train your eye. There is a sway in the foot. Find the live sole plane and follow it exactly, all the way around. Hope this helps...
  7. Progressional Video Of My Navicular Horse

    Congratulations! I see he's got his float back!. Better balance, less toe, less head bobbing. Hope the diet is nice and tight. May he never go there again.
  8. Who's Your Mentor?

    Pretty much the same path as Trinity, lol! I like it when you guys post links, it helps to keep me moving forward!
  9. Medio-Lateral Imbalance Fores And Hinds

    There are changes happening. The hoof is going thru transition and concavity was there and has bloomed. The bars, however, are excessive. The deep wells of collateral groove at the back of the frog are wider, but that's not concavity, thats the bars folding over and pushing the sole out of its way. Don't let your eye trick you. True earned concavity happens at the apex. All this materail has migrated, flared out the toe and bevel needs to be reset. Are you giving the feet a couple of hours to air out every 24 hours? Treat for thrush before booting as well? Do those boots breathe? I'd also go to a whole pad. Just lowering the bars and the quarters is going set this hoof more upright on the heels. There's where you find the heels that should be prominent and facing the ground. From the front of the heel platform, all the way around to the front of the other heel platform is higher than the heels. See the pic below, the whole hoof, that "bonnet" shape. Everything getting pushed out (and up) the front and it starts with the bars. Since the farrier is on his way, I wouldn't touch the feet and leave him something to work with. Since he is coming, it would be respectful to defer to him until then. Just between us, this is what I would hope, would happen. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8547971306/ The red line, roughly from this view is the sole plane. All material beyond it should be even with it and angled flat to ground. Look at that red line all the way around. See where it is at the quarters, where it leaves the heel? That's clearing your quarters. Everything out from there, flat to ground and that's without disturbing the whiter colored callous behind the red line...even with it and flat to ground all the way out. The black line on the inside of the blue area is the leading edge of the bevel...everything outside of that at a 45 degree bevel. The black outside area after that is removed from the top and gone. The trim won't have arrived, but will respond and that's what the horse wants now. I wouldn't have done this trim before the boots. I can see it now. Look at the bars. See them as coming up out of the groove and how high those walls are. Big, mounded height, splatted over and curved outward, to turn and smash right back into the frog again. Follow the wall all the way down on the right side of the frog and see it pounding into the whole length of the frog. The height of the wall is pounding into the corium as it rolls over its mounded highness. A big push forward. The bars should be straight and right on the other side of the groove from the frog. They also need to be shorter ramps that merge from the sole halfway back on the frog and ramp straight up to meet the heel platforms dead on, leaving the profile of the heel platforms prominent, not the bars. The bevel at the toe, the bars brought under control, is what is going to stand these heels up better. I have a strong feeling that you are going to get out of this negative palmer situation faster because of the boots, but maintain well, because thrush can eat away at the very things you're trying to build.
  10. Can't See The Pictures?

    My pics? Still getting to know Flickr. Which ones?
  11. Purina Bmz

    No mention of copper? Copper is the real star player in hoof connective tissue. It works with zinc to fight iron.Zinc works either with copper, or against it and both of them either work together to control iron or against it. Any iron in it?. I don't like to see them focus on one or a few ingredients and tout them. What about selenium, a very important one for feet. They are all important and will be deficient if they are not in balance with each other. No copper or Se or Methionine in the analysis. My take is an incomplete guessing game.
  12. Medio-Lateral Imbalance Fores And Hinds

    Missyclare is the same way. She has 2 turns in the leg. She is straight at the knee, but the knee cap is turned and so many times, I've seen, where there usually is a deviation, there is a correcting deviation down the line. Missyclare has another turn to pidgeon-toed just above the coronary band. In Dr. Kellon's words, in this case, you must trim to the live sole plane. In Pete Ramey's words, just follow the sole and let it tell you what it wants to be and it will be right for the horse. That's what you've done. I consider myself doing well, if the sole has been followed, the frog is evenly seated and the apex is pointing to 12 o'clock, which is what you have accomplished. What I have corrected is where you have missed a couple of spots of finding the live sole plane, (the quarters) If things are not doing well, you get clues, like heel shearing, crushing, and white line separating. With the heel shearing, What is causing the heel shearing is difference in height between the inside toe quarter and the lateral heel. The inside is weighted, pulls forward harder on the ground on that side, (straighter side) Continues to dictate on forward and breakover on the inside toe quarter, which pulls more forward in prominence . If you look at the LF Sole pic, and compare the toe shape with my yellow circle, you've got the shape of that bevel pretty well established as well. Its just that the heels are too short and from back to front is not balanced. What is in between them is a high quarters that are dictating and both quarters high in the run from heel to toe. Take a look at the heel shot without lines at all. Ask yourself if you have obeyed the sole. It's perfect from 10-2, now look at the sides. See how the wall does a slow bow up from the sole?...not followed. With the heels being short, toe good, its like the suggestion of a rocker shape between them. So, you find that sole and obey it all the way around. Its been crazy hair-pulling, I imagine, but it does lessen as the ducks get in order. Just see it for what it is (which you can) and check the sole, find the high spot and just tweak it. Missyclare took 3 years to transition and I don't think she completely arrived on it, though concavity is good. Frog could be better, but she definitely prefers longer heels. The inside heel is no longer pulling forward so badly and is back there better where it belongs. I also was unable to bring the toe back as I would have liked to. (I don't see this problem here) Although I've never had the means for xrays, I'm convinced that her P3 has slipped its moorings permanently. When I apply the bevel, instead of responding, it fills right back out there. If I push the envelope, she get sore, so I don't sweat it. Listen and learn. When I relieve the toe by renewing the bevel, the relief is instant to her knees. I can tell by the way that she moves, that its time to renew the bevel. She was disgustingly flared forward, never any shoes, but a pasture trim. She was 17 when I started trimming and she's 27 now....has a heel first landing, torque free and with confidence. It all comes together in the end, just keep obeying the sole and give her patience to get her ducks in order. I picked up on your horse having swellings at the knees as well. Is she on a joint supplement? Probably wouldn't hurt. Did she have a long breakover when you started? A toe way out there puts excess torque on the toe, flares the toe more outward on breakover and the jam from that goes right up into the knees. I proved this to myself one winter tip-toeing on ice and chronic screaming knees. Then I realized that I didn't have a heel first landing. Fixed that and knee pain went right away. Since her breakover is greatly improved, so will be the relief to her knees. Other than the heels being too short and couple of tiny high spots, this trim and these pics should serve as a good template and I give you flying colors and pat on the back. Have faith. (I hope the vet doesn't say the words, wedged shoes) In 2 weeks or so, you should have the heels she needs. In the meantime, keep them square and strong, with a surface flat to ground (think shape) The toe of old has pulled the heels forward. Now the most of the toe pull is off and its just the heels needing to get back to where they belong. You use the growth to find the shape/pull them back, not shorter. Right Front Do you still think the high side is on the medial side? Do you think the frog is pointing outward like the leg is? (2nd compensating turn) The top short green line on the left is the shape of the mounded higher white line. The bottom green line is the shape it should be, Where that bottom green line is, all the way around to where the white and red line merge at the toe, is the length of that bow of highness. Because its high, its in the brunt, hence the mounding shape....a symptom of pathology. If you lower the inside, you put the already higher outside further in the brunt and worsen the symptoms. If you don't want to correct it all the way, then just tweak it a little bit and see how the hoof likes it and what the sole is telling you in a week. Don't go after it, tweak it, wait for some growth and look lots/obey the sole. Its like living a soap opera, commercials and all. Your bevels on the sides are just a tad too severe as well. The leading edge of the bevel should LEAVE the inside half of the wall intact and bevel on out from there. This provides support. The hoofprint on this hoof is actually smaller than the hoof itself. You should not see sole higher than the wall, should be even. When you are taking the wall down and you're getting close to the sole, you can hit the nail on the head better if you close your eyes, run your thumb over sole/wall/and off and there should be no difference in their heights. You should also feel the turn from sole to flat-to-ground and the flatness that faces the ground. Then apply the bevel. What clearing the quarters will do, will give you a straighter run to the toe, eliminate the rocker shape, eliminate the high side/symptoms and bringing the middle down between heel and toe will relieve the arch in the coronary band. In effect, you are helping the heels to be taller before they've grown out. Make sense?
  13. Medio-Lateral Imbalance Fores And Hinds

    LEFT FRONT What taking the wall down to sole has done, is help with the concavity, and help find the balance that this foot wants on its own. It's just a little short in the heel dept, which has pulled on the DDFT. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8516338441/ Drew contour lines on the existing. The inside toe quarter is high, dictating to the diagonal outside heel with a force that goes over the wall and crushes. Note the balance lines. Good and perpendicular with the center line, but fan out showing the inside toe quarter curving upward. From one end of the red line, to the other, is the angle of contact. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8516336547/ The heels need to grow as shown, the quarters cleared, especially on the inside, toe not touched. The solid white is flat to ground, then the bevel is applied. The bar needs to be cleaned up a bit on the right side, not touched on the left side. Note that the balance lines on this one are just a tad less perpendicular to the center line. Note also that the whole heel pillars squared up in white should be the same shape as the lines across the whole back of the hoof and should not be able to see the ground surface of them, should be looking at the back of the heel pillars only. Pay attention to the shape that my lines give, because form is function. (even though the heels need to come back and are slamming forward on contact, you can tweak this flat-to-ground shape and make them face the ground anyway, helping to stop the slam forward on the heels on contact.) On the first side shot above, look at the ground line of red new and white existing at the heels as they come forward. Right where the red and white lines start to separate....there's your flat to ground heel pillar, even though its still pulled forward. Think shape. You don't have to lower to improve delivery. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8517452154/ Note again, that the red line is a tad less perpendicular to the center line, but balance is improved and inside quarter not dictating to diagonal heel. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8517454204/ I will keep working on these pics, you study them, should only be using the fine side of the rasp where tweaking is needed and lots of looking to arrive on the mark. I wanted to post these already, because I didn't want you to think I'd forgotten you. Adding this one showing the placement of the bevel. (thick grey line... everthing bevelled from that line outward) Just maintain what you have and don't do this one until the heels have grown a bit. The bevel will put the weight back on the heels automatically, promoting a heel first landing. If the heels are too short to be supportive, then the weight/crushing is worsened, So, for now, maintain the bevel as you have been and wait for the heels.
  14. This foot isn't bad. I like the length that the walls are right now and they are even with the live sole plane. This hoof is much improved in straightening out from before. Left heel needs to come down a tad to balance and shape fixed on the right side, otherwise, ok and trim coming along.
  15. Medio-Lateral Imbalance Fores And Hinds

    I can see where you are getting at (have downloaded the pic from flickr): I should get the toe wall to move back (by means of a strong bevel / rocker?) thus getting the heels to move back and under. No. This pic is what needs to happen in the future, not now. Your bevels are fine and doing all that they can do. The toes are short enough, the heels too short. As for the fores, if I do let the heels grow to a few millimeters, the situation with the inside heels quickly deteriorates, I have tried that, especially the inside heel of the right fore gets pulled not just forward, but inwards and forward to the diagonal (outside) toe (her breakover), the heel collapses and the (quarter) wall cannot take the strain and cracks (happened while still in professional care, the remnants have only just grown out). What you describe is heel shearing. This can be the way it is because of the way she uses her foot....a given. The balance on the trim can either aggravate this, or help to control in the face of it. The hinds: Especially with the hinds the situation with the negative palmar angle is bad, I know that. I was even thinking of shoeing again, but she brushes her opposite leg with iron shoes. We will try and fit the easycare boots on the hinds with the pad this afternoon. I rockered the toes on the hinds yesterday and took two millimeters off the toe underneath to get some relief, will take pictures of this too. Its not just just the hinds, its all of them to protect the heel growth while it grows. That would be two pads/foot as described. Any further trimming after these pictures, makes these ones redundant, as I'm already splitting hairs and having to be very exact due to the need for growth. The tight trimming box these feet are in, may just have gotten tighter. I'll need a full set of pics again. Maybe I will just have to become more aggressive on the hinds' toe rocker? No. Take aggressive right out of this conversation. The opposite needs to happen. Don't sweat this. Instead of trying to fix and dictate, grow and listen to that growth and do as you are told only....only THEN it is good for the horse. The pads will help to protect that growth and in the meantime, if we can, will tweak only the places that need to be tweaked to coax optimal growth. We will spend this time getting to know what this mare needs by educating our eyes and listening to her and what she needs. Two-four weeks of padding, listening, waiting for growth and only tweaking in the right places should see her improving.
  16. Medio-Lateral Imbalance Fores And Hinds

    I too would like to see conformational shots. Show me the cow hockness by taking a pic, camera on the ground 6' behind the horse, tail tied up. Again on the front showing up to just above the knees, both feet centered. These pics are good, just need to see what's going on above. The stifles are probably causing the slamming. You have arrived on the shortness of this trim, which means if you are to get balanced, you're going to have to allow for some growth at the heels. All feet are going into a negative palmer angle. I see much stress on the ddft. going on, as well as the coronary band. The frog is burgeoning because the heels are too short and its having to do the job for them alone. There is a need to tweak very lightly only in certain places while you wait for the heels to grow. The hoof needs padding at the heels to support the shortness of the heels and get the tension off the ddft in the meantime. The lines I draw will help the balance in the meantime, but its just going to be a correctional tweak while you wait for growth. In short the medial/lateral balance is off a bit, but the imbalance going on from back to front is more serious. I will be back to draw lines, but I owe someone a LF foot first, but I'll be back. (sorry, been crazy busy) If you have boots, great, but if not, pad anyway. Children's playground mats cut into pads that start just behind the widest part of the foot, right back to the heels.This one against the foot, then another whole pad below it. The heels raised up just enough to get the tension off the ddfts and wait for the heels to grow up and take over the support. We must go this route to offer relief to the horse, as the trim is short enough, which puts you in a tight trimming box and we need the growth to have something to work with and correct. Study this. The difference in bone balance is the neg. palmer angle. When you look at the existing bone balance, the pull on the ddft should make sense. These are not trim lines, more like an existing vs. what needs to be in future. I'll be back......
  17. Deep Groove In Sole

    Excessive bar. The bar ramps need to established in the height and shape shown and the rest needs to be peeled off the sole in a butterfly thin layer every few days until it is down and melded with the surrounding. This is what causes abscesses and this is only one side of the hoof and only one hoof to check. If you sliver a thin layer off the top and try to pinch in it half with your fingers, bar won't break, sole will.
  18. I agree.Get on top of it, moving forward, less transitioning to the trim and soft ground to be nice in the interim. (snow and mud) Because suddenly, the way it works out, in the space of two weeks into the summer, the ground gets suddenly harder and is not so forgiving and the progress you've made already, will stand his hooves in good stead to keep moving forward instead of getting slapped sideways by it. Prepare for that hard ground that is to come. I'm in heaven right now. Since everything is snow covered, the whole place has become a pasture paradise! The gate is open and hay is spread out the length and width of the field and they are moving on it. Since the days are numbered and things are melting, I'm going for it and making them go for it. My piles are out on the perimeter of the field in 1 1/2' deep snow and they are moving on it. When the snow is gone, ground thawed and delicate to hooves, and they are really penned up, believe me, I'm going for it right now. Things couldn't be better right now and I"m taking advantage of it. At this point in time, my old mare has never moved better for the movement she's getting. I'm noticing it. (sans any supplements) No movement because of winter? I'm seeing it in the very opposite. This is the time that the depth of snow makes them work and I don't have any grass to worry about and the growth is easily manageable. Come harder ground, the transition is already ahead of the game and its just a matter of toughening up to the hard ground that is to come...poised to fly in the face of it, cause its coming. So, don't think, no movement because of winter, go for it, prepare for what's to come, to laugh in the face of ALL of it. Layer up and go for a ride, the hardest part is getting out the door, the rest is history. Really, I layer up and I'm just groaning through the process and I get out the door and the next thing I remember is I've lost my hat, lost my mitts and 5 hours have gone by! It's the movement that makes everything come together and less you have to trim for, because the development is shining through. I'm starting on the rears: This trim will get good balance established and start you on the right road. RR http://www.flickr.co...N03/8501762629/ http://www.flickr.co...N03/8501762821/ The walls need to come down as shown, as well as pulling back on the heels to the white-lined heel height. A little more on the right side and a little more bar on that side too. Note the shape on the heel platforms that go straight across the whole hoof and so should they look like to your eye. Straight across and balanced to each other, just like that line. The bevel should leave a hair of the inside wall intact and bevel at a 45 degree angle from 10-2 o'clock, then fade out to only take the outer half of wall away on the quarters. Once you get this balance established, it will just be a matter of obeying the sole next time and getting shorter as the sole tells you. When the sole lets you get shorter, its also getting thicker and preparing for that hard ground ahead. The frog will come into work with the heels and the heel bulbs will become better defined/developed as well. LR A bit more heel and wall height to take on this hoof, as it is longer than the other. I haven't gone into great written detail, but I have the feeling that you know the drill. If you have any questions, please ask.
  19. Need Help, I'm Stumped.

    Laminitis is a symptom of Lime disease and its also a symptom of IR/Cushings. It's like a double whammy and both need to be monitored. It looks like you are doing the right moves. Horses on pergolide or prescend need to be monitored and the ACTH test done a couple of times a year to keep tabs on it and the dosage should be changed accordingly. The dosage is what works for the horse at the time. The other weak spot is possibly the diet. There is definitely a call to get it tightened right down to specifics, adequate and most importantly....balanced nutrition. I suggest that you join here http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/EquineCushings/ and click on the files section and do some quality reading on the matter. There are horses just like this that are meeting success. There are also other things out there that can help these symptoms. You can post your horse's history, including blood tests and get excellent one on one medical advice on all these things. You really would do well to be here.
  20. Movement Off?

    I guess all we can do is play a guessing game with this video. What I can see is that he is very pretty, well disciplined horse! I suspect that he may have arthritis in his left front knee, though its probably both, knees. When he crosses the first poles at the beginning, he just about knuckles over on last pole. I don't think he's lazy either, but see a lot of head rocking to swing himself into the canter before his feet actually comply.(reluctance produced from pain) Where he comes out of the one where he has to enter the box, back up and leave by the platform, there is a lot of head rocking in the canter leaving with his left lead. When he gets to the next object and enters it in from behind, he looks like he actually does knuckle over on the left foot and stumbles slightly, but not sure because his leg is behind the pole. But he is coming down to a walk, weight thrown forward onto those front feet. So my guess is arthritis in the knees. I also noticed that he doesn't have a heel first landing, landing very flat footed, which means there will be impact (from his descending weight) going up the front wall of his hoof and on up into his knees. This will be happening at the moment when the hoof is breaking over and leaving the ground. It is a flat landing and long breakover that will augment the impact going up the front. I had an occasion to experience this first hand one winter. Things were icy at the barn for a long time. I was walking flat with a toe first landing the whole time to keep from falling down. My knees were screaming and in a chronic pain situation. Then I thought, you tell people that a horse should have a heel first landing for things to work right, for tendons and muscles to work in the right direction and flow, not crunch back into itself. So I got everything shovelled and started walking heel first with a purpose and the chronic knee pain that was almost crippling me for months, went entirely away in 5 days. I also have a 27 year old with arthritic knees. She is also transitioned to the barefoot trim. When I renew the bevel, I insure a heel first landing, but also release torque at the toe incredibly. She is a different horse walking away from the trim, freed up and flowing. 5 minutes with a rasp is all it took. The arthritis is there, it will always be there, as there is no cure for it. My goal is to keep the torque off her hoof, so that she is not aggravating it with every step. The symptoms of a long breakover are an oval shaped hoof, a flat or toe first landing and raised knee action to avoid the toe that's so out there like clown's shoe. The impact goes straight up to the knees. Make sure that the balance on his foot is perfect, or work towards it. This would be the trim on his foot. The bevel on the toe releases the toe and allows it to roll over effortlessly and also gets the toe out of the way and promotes a heel first landing. The horse will have a sweeping and rolling motion of hoof from heel to toe and off, in a much more economical movement. There will be less knee lifting and slamming down kind of action. So my advise is to get the hoof balanced and working properly and keep it that way by staying on top of the trim. This is good advice for every horse. You can either be slapped sideways by life or have things optimal that helps him laugh in the face of it anyway. There are 5 hearts in a horse. Four of them are in his feet. If the four in his feet are not working properly, you can be sure that the one in his chest is working harder than ever to compensate. As he compensates body-wide for this, I'm not surprised that he is "out" in other places of his body, including all the way up to his spine. The path of pathology can be very long indeed. The knees could very well be the first more more nasty pinch point in the path of that pathology. Get him balanced, do strengthening exercises if needed and check back with the chiro again later. A balanced foot means he will be able to do good homework after his chiro visit, vs. not and getting "out" again. Hope this helps....... As for supplements, I have never had my old girl on any until this year. I tried the supplements out of the tack store to no avail. Then I discovered one put together by a student of Dr. Kellons, overseen and approved by her. Its called Move-Ease and is at mybesthorse.com. I try to avoid Bute at all costs, and this stuff enabled me to. It's made my eyebrows go up several times this year with another horse, bringing him out of a 3-legged lameness situation. (sacro-illiac problem) It won't tell you what's in it, as it is a proprietary formula, but being a student of Dr. Kellon's, I went ahead and had faith....I wasn't disappointed. Easier on the pocket too and definitely worth a try. But, if the hoof isn't balanced, the problem at hand is more mechanical and how he is using his feet and a good balance trim will see him in more comfort instantly.
  21. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8478185566/ http://www.flickr.co...N03/8478186440/ http://www.flickr.co...N03/8474514907/ The first trimmer had a plan and it worked. The toe is back about half way, the sole is getting its ducks in order and the white line is tighter. The 2nd trimmer has forgotten the bars, left the growth on the heels, so they are longer than ever and more imbalanced than before. The coronary band is too shallow in its run because of it. I think this is the better hoof, though you could split hairs on the matter. On the heel shot, the red lines are a balanced trim, so still higher on the left side, including the heel. The black line is the length the heels really should be. Compare the side shots of my old and this one. What needed to be in my first one was not much, just heel and toe to come back. Now look at what needs to be done to the hoof now to find the same balance. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8477126989/ Geez Louise! . This horse is on a lean to the left in both feet. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8477097941/ Look at the box of red lines. That's the existing heel balance. You get the feeling of "down on the outside", which is what is happening. Also note the angle of the red lines on the heel pillars coming down to the base line. When he steps on those heels, the pressure pinches inward and upward with the direction of those lines. Heels can't widen, The shape of the heels should be like the white line. http://www.flickr.co...N03/8477097069/ This is the RF again. Heel balance isn't as bad. Frog has receded to where it belongs. Look at the little windows produced on the heels between the red and black lines. What you should see in those windows is not the back of the heel pillars, but the tops of them staring you right in the face. That is the heel platforms coming back under the horse's descending weight. They need to come back more to be directly above the base line. That's how pulled forward they are, but a work in progress. Sorry to say, I'm not happy with this trim. Keep trying to get that first trimmer on the phone. If you keep bugging her, she should call you back or find another. Was that 2nd one certified? No matter, I don't think she has the eye for balance. She hasn't improved the medial/lateral balance that the 1st trimmer had started and the heels have lost it. Toe is coming back, but heels need to come back with it. This will give the pressure effect of the forward/long heels/still forgotten bars, running into a toe that is trying to come back. The idea is to get rid of pathology, not add to it. I will take a look at the hinds and remember the hocks tomorrow night. If you wish to try and tweak this yourself, better pics in the garage with fetlock hair in a pony tail (lol!) and on the heel shots, back up a bit from the hoof and lean forward a bit more. I need to see from the cannon, all the way to the toe and showing the whole run of the frog to show you best.
  22. I get the feeling that if this toe doesn't start to come back, there's going to be pressure trouble on the hoof. The indented band on the wall going around the side on the side shot is like pinched in overhang from the much higher inside in the past. The front wall below the coronary band has a convex shape and a slight pinch in below the band where the pressure is travelling up to from the toe being way out there. The whole run of the band to the toe is slightly too steep to the front, by the long breakover and jammed up at the back by a heel that needs to come back a tad and quarter cleared in front of it. In my opinion, the toe should have come back 1/2 way of what it really needs to be. There's a fine line between being conservative and not promoting. As long as the bevel is not placed to get the torque off the toe, none of the other pathology will improve. This foot is settling in nicely, but the toe torque is still on and front wall looking worse. What's happening is that the flare is sloughing off the hoof and puddling around the hoof at the ground line, giving the front wall that convcave shape. Still pulling and needs to be released. I'm glad she's coming back in 3 weeks.Toe first, then the heel and thrush in the meantime. I only had time to do one hoof, as I have to git to bed. I hope the pics turn out bigger than they are showing here....grrr. Will you be able to grab them and put in Photoshop and enlarge?
  23. I like this trim.P3 is low, though. Dry/hard ground conditions and a sole to match. Upped risk of abscess and set back. Toe crack still needs to heal and the greatest amount of torque happens at the toe. The wall is also thin at the toe, so it needs protection. The pink is the size the hoof should be, the grey is where the bone is sitting and the solid grey is the navicular bone. Do you see how the higher bar on the right side and where the bone is related to it? The flat area on the sole on the left side quarter. That side was higher and needed to be brought down and balanced. See how the jamming of that side has jammed that heel bulb? If you put a rasp across the hoof from 9 to 3 o'clock and measure the depth down to the bottom of the groove at the apex and its less than 1/2", then you need boots. When P3 is low in the hoof, its also on thin sole. The horse's descending weight comes down on the inside of that sole and inflames. Then you've got the hard ground coming up on the outside of that sole. Double whammy. Its the inflammation that causes bone changes. The xray: After seeing the diagram above, does this look a bit more familiar? The wide joint spacing indicates inflammation,( I'm not a vet either.) See the thin structure with the dark outline, the wedge shape above it? I believe these are called lolipops and are evidence, but don't trouble the horse. If you look at the other xray, you'll see 3 small lolipops. The low bone, the thin sole, the toe first landing that crunches right back to the lolipops all point to history of flare forward on this hoof. I am happy to say that toe is much improved, has created a heel first landing in the process and has stopped this aggravation in its tracks. With the bone still low on thin sole, it still hurts to weight it. Unlike every other bone in the horse's body, bone is surrounded by a periosteum that can re-form and heal, but the hoof. is surrounded by a corium, won't remediate, just destructs. These are many solid reasons to wear boots and move forward/faster. The magic is in the padding. Its the give and take of the cushion, support from below, protection from the ground and itself that does that. If the boots get bigger, stick another pad in there while you re-assess and let him bounce around with confidence...you riding with equal confidence and getting that movement that develops. Looking forward to those minerals! I agree that the hoof could use a good soaking and scrubbing and thrush treatment for the remaining stretched white line, but don't push it too often, remember that ground, but that sole is going to be stubborn. The horse needs it as much as he needs it to be gone. Boots erase the issue. On the picture, see that blob on the sole directly ahead of the apex? That's frog smashed into sole left behind as it receded. More evidence of a prominent toe in the past. Now lets hope these pictures work....grrr.
  24. Hoof Help

    Oh dear! I can see them! I'll have to go back to the drawing board on this one! Geez! Sorry....be back. Well, I got the links to the pics, but still not able to bring them here. It seems to be working, let me know.