edenn3583

Sweet Itch/mtg -pics New Symptoms

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Vet seems to think it is only allergies to the fly saliva. They gave me medicated shampoo and cond. and a steroid to give him over the course of a month. They would not even listen to the worm theory and said that occurs in foals. (this vet is not the normal one that I use I could not get a quick appt with them) His cracks look like they happened from swelling although what I saw did not seem bad enough to break the skin. They gave me 40.00 with of shampoo and conditioner and a steroid that is for injection but they want me to give it orally. Why would he have a reaction like this if it were not worms? to the wormer mabe? These were the results that are expected with NTW as found on the internet. I'm going to wait three weeks and single dose again.

Edited by edenn3583

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A couple of years ago, I used an "all natural" fly spray that had been highly recommended. Spraying it on - I noticed that it had a very strong tobbaco smell to it. Within seconds after I finished the spraying process, I had an asthma attack. That is nothing uncommon for me, so I did not think to wash it off of him. The next day, my horse's skin looked just like yours. Cracked and peeling all over his body. I felt like such a schmuck. He had an allergic reaction to the spray. I bathed him with Melaseptic Shampoo and coated all of the places with Equiderma after he dried. It cleared up completely in about 4 days. We did not have to use steroids on him because he was never exposed to the allergen again. You can't really get away from flies.

Your poor horse.

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Today he is looking wonderful, pic later on this evening. His skin has been leathery all summer and all that flaking off must have been that, because I brushed it off and his skin is very soft and healthy looking now. Still a few flakes and is is a little sore but he looks great.

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The flaking in the above pics looks like when I accidentally got some MTG on my horse's skin. I was using it on his mane for growth and some dripped down and his whole neck and shoulder got like that.

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I don't think its the MTG, I think it is a response to the worming, not the wormer but the worms. I took him riding today and he was wonderful. He looks great, the best he has looked, thanks for everyones help

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Wow. This was an amazing thread to read and thank you for posting the pictures to show exactly what was going on! I hope this info is able to help other horse owners who have similar problems.

Below is a link I found about NTWs. I copied/pasted the part about NTWs below the link.

http://horsehints.org/Parasites.htm

Neck Threadworms (Onchocera) (Microfilariae)

I have had two horses with Onchocera. It is often misdiagnosed because many vets have not seen it. My husband and I purchase 2 year olds and then proceed to do our own training and handling, etc. A vet check will not pick this up because it does not usually show signs until later (arorund 2 years of age). You will see several types of symptoms. The horse will get summer sores or bumps along their top and bottom lines. These are caused by the dead worms. Sometimes the bumps will break and infect. The horse will often rub his bottom line along the ground rocking back and forth because of irritation. You might see large losses of hair on the horse's body. Also, the mane and tail hairs break off and can get quite nasty looking. Along the back neck line where the mane attaches, you can feel indentations in a tidy row down the horse's neck line. The neck threadworms migrate to this area and die. This is what you are feeling. Sometimes the Onchocera gets off its usual path to the top and bottom line of the horse, and travel to the eyes instead. We have had both happen. The horse tends to rub his head on everything because of the irritation. "The most common parasite connected with uveitis is onchocerca. Culicoides, a biting midge of the Ceiatopogonidae family, is believed to be the primary transmitter. The adult lives in the connective tissue of the horse's neck and the microfilariae travel throughout the body. The most common signs of it are sores breaking out on the midline of the horse's stomach, base of the mane and withers and uveitis in the horse's eye(s) (French, 1988). Uveitis occurs when there are large quantities of dead microfilariae in the eye. Normally the eye can handle the live ones but the dead give off large amounts of antigens and these cause inflammation in the eye (Schwink, op cit p. 560). Ironically for horse owners, onchocerca can sometimes first be identified by the onset of symptoms following worming with ivermectin. This is one drug that will effectively kill off the young microfilariae, but at the same time by doing its job it can initiate uveitis if a large quantity of the microfilariae are in the eye at the time of worming. After uveitis has started, some owners find that administering bute or banamine several days before and after worming can control the inflammation so that the uveitis does not flare up every time the horse is wormed. This also might indicate that in dealing with abandoned or abused horses who may not have been wormed on a regular basis, consulting a veterinarian regarding the possibility of onchocerca microfilariae in the eye before worming may prevent uveitis in addition to its other problems. A conjunctival biopsy can be used to identify onchocerca microfilariae in the eye, but it does involve using auriculopalpebral nerve block and topical anesthesia. Once the inflammation has quieted, treatment can commence. Diethylcarbamazine and ivermectin are two drugs that are used (Cook, 1983)." Equine Recurrent Uveitis

You will see a constant water stream out of the eye or eyes. There may be a white or yellow mucous in the eye on a regular basis. Many times vets will think this is a blocked tear duct. Again, there may be hair loss around the face and eye area. Ivermectin is the conventional treatment, but it did not really work for our horses. My vet of 24 years, was an incredible vet. She had a diagnostic sense unlike any that I have ever seen. Unfortunately, she is not in private practice any more. We surely miss her. She had a way of thinking outside the box. We had Wedgewood Pharmacy compound a pill for our horses that has worked really well after the Ivermectin did not. It is called Diethylcarbamazine Citrate. The capsules are each 400 mg. It is basically heart worm medicine compounded into capsule form. We open two capsules, once a week, and place the powder in a cup of sweet feed and the horse eats it. No problem! Spring time is when the Onchocera becomes most active. This has worked for both horses. You can discuss this with your vet. If not managed, complications can be blindness if in the eyes, and if left untreated, adult worms can travel into the ligaments and tendons of the horse. The horse may eventually fall and stumble. They can cause swelling and bumps because of the hardening of dead worms.

Unlike many other worms the neck threadworm has an indirect life cycle. The threadworm relies on another organism to get it to the horse. The biting midge transmits the threadworm from horse to horse.

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I'm so glad to hear that there has been healing. I take NO credit for this. I'm just passing on information I've learned. Alas, vets are not up on NTWs very often. You always get the same "allergic to fly saliva" response when they see a horse presented such as yours and they poo-poo the NTW possibility.

I'm also NOT saying that it's "always" the cause....But NTWs are so much more prevalent than anyone has ever believed so it never hurts to try.

Please spread the word!!!!

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The vet also tried to tell me it only occured in foals... so Banjo did not have it. But everything I read talked about one type of thread worm occuring in foals and the NTW occuring in all horses

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Newest pics. So this is like 5-6 days out from the initial post.'

Tail Before:

100_0429.jpg

Tail Today:

100_0473.jpg

Throat latch before:

100_0437.jpg

After worming

100_0465.jpg

Today:

100_0474.jpg

Chest before:

100_0443.jpg

After Worming:

100_0464.jpg

Today:

100_0476.jpg

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thank you all so much for the informative thread! wow!

My old guy has rubbed his butt raw and it looks just like Banjo, so I am sure this is what he has. I have been cleaning and spraying with no luck, so I am just thrilled to read this.

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You know...I think this is what my young mare had two summers in a row. She would rub her face, neck, crest, chest, shoulders, belly and upper tail BALD & RAW. I tried covering her in fly spray, feeding her flaxseed and used TriHist from the vet. Nothing really worked.

This year, she had NO reactions. 0_o Her belly looks beautiful with no red sores or bumps.

The only thing different is last year I started giving her the whole tube* of de-wormer, so I wonder if I accidentally killed the NTWs with the larger doses?

*I figured after she spit out a little bit, she was getting closer to the correct amount she was supposed to have.

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our old boy (25+) gets the same thing, way worse then your guy,(my guy looses weight from all the itching). he is allergic to no-seems(sp?) he also has been in liver failure so we try to stay away from most meds.

HOSE him as often as possible, insects are attracted to sweat. Also the itching becomes a habit.

I use MTG but only when he rubs, maybe 1-2 times a month. the flaking you see is his dead skin, the MTG makes it stick to his hair, he is also sensetive because he has rubbed himself raw. when you get bit by something & scratch too much you get sensetive also. I also agree you should use SWAT on the bigger areas & his face. GOOD LUCK

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Banjo is doing good, i've been applying calmcoat to his affected areas, he has scratched once but only what a normal horse would do, his hair was barley ruffled. He looks great. I'll try and get a few more pics in a week or so.

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My horse gets this every spring/summer too. I used to have my vet do monthly injections of ivermectin which is basically the same as double dosing. Now I do daily wormer and do simple topical treatments. There are 3 things I cannot live without as soon as my horsey comes in with pom-pom tail.

Veterinarian's Best Hot Spot Spray

Stops the itch. Starts the healing. Tea tree oil, aloe, and chamomile. Expensive but so worth it. You may use sparingly as it bubbles up a little when you spray it on and then you can rub it in. My main line of defense.

Horseman's Dream Aloe Vet Cream

This is the blue cream. You can put this in horse hair and it won't get goopy, oily, or drippy. Great for it they rub it raw and get sores.

A good fly spray.

Always put on the topical and coat it with a good fly spray like TriTec or Endure.

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HEY I CAN TELL YOU HAVING A SENSITIVE HORSE IS A CHORE IN ITS SELF.. I have a filly that is allergic to sweat and all grasses ect . I have found something that really has worked and it is cheap and easy to find . It is T-plus gel shampoo for humans , you can buy it at the dollar general stores . It is only a couple of dollars and it has cleared my fillys problems up completely. try it ,it will either help and if not your horse will get some relief from the ichting and flaking that goes along with allergys ...I have not had a problem with this product and it has cleared all her bald spots in just a week or so ... She seems to like the feeling it gives her when used . I think it soothes the inflammed skin . I hope I have helped, I know how frustrating this is to you .

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Hello again. About a week ago, I double dosed my 30 year old gelding with Equimax after reading this. He had rubbed his butt RAW [shocked] and it was very ugly indeed. When I got the wormer, I told the sales woman about why I was doing it, and she also recommended rubbing straight ivermectin right onto the wound. This had worked for her a year ago with the same issue on her mare's chest. I don't know which product worked, but I did both and he is now much better! so Thanks!

Anyone else hear about using ivermectin topicly before?

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I've never heard that, Banjo is rubbing again, I'm going to wash him in the morning with the expensive shampoo and worm him again on the 30th. He is not raw, but it does not take long for the hair to start becoming missing. His belly is raw again too, I had equispot on him, which REALLY helps and i had two tubes and now they are missing. I put the fly sheet and mask on him in the stall this morning and sprayed fly spray on him.

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Not yet, chocomare said after two weeks and it is just now two weeks, I wanted to wait three weeks because of the life cycle of most worms. And the vet said I should not have to double dose next time, would you dd again or just try the single dose.

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Id double dose to be sure 100%. Dewormer is cheap enough. If you dont double dose and you dont get them all then all this is wasted no? Kill em all if thats what it is and it does appear to be.

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You might also try mixing vaseline with Campho-phenique and applying to his belly. All three of my horses had raw skin from the middle of their front legs all the way to the back earlier this summer. I applied this mixture 2 x day and the relief was instant. After a few days, they were healing nicely. It is not a cure, but it definitely will make him more comfy. My old gelding used to rock back and forth on a low tree branch to rub his underside. The first time I applied this to his belly, he walked from the feed trough about half way to the tree and then stopped dead in his tracks. You could almost see him thinking about his belly. He then turned and went out to graze....no belly rubbing. Hope it helps!

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Just wanted to put in my part. The double dosing is because the microfilia can be traveling deep to get to ligaments to become adults and further this type of worm requires high doses in order to trully be effective. Further the battle continues some of us have horses that for years we have kept NTW under control thru deworming every three weeks. My horse has no more problems by doing this. And we had a horrendous rain rot problem that is controlled thru worming.

Edited by little d

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