steph1

Animal Breeding.

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I cruised the pet shelters for 6 months looking for the "right" pup. Nothing there I wanted to try and live with, so I'm MORE than grateful someone bred THIS litter! Yes I'm kind of "dog specific". I know what personalities I can live with.

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Most of the poodle crosses are done to be hypo allergenic I feel that's a good reason versus puggles and others

^^ Which is a Wive's Tale. Poodles are not any more hypo allergenic than I am. :rolleye0014:

There were some tests done somewhere a while ago, (I'm old, don't remember the actual University) that disproved that. People are not allergic to the dog HAIR, it's the saliva & dander. Haven't met a dog yet that doesn't have dog spit. There's rumors about Bichons being more of a hypo dog... maybe because they are better bred than the average poodle & have better teeth, so less rotten tooth goo? IDK.

MOST of the Poodle crosses are to create some stupid "Designer" name, & make a few bucks on self-perceived Kyootness. MOSTLY, poodle crosses are nothing other than the Professional Groomer's Worst Nightmares.

As I said, I am getting old, my back hurts, my elbows are shot, my wrists suck, & I have arthritis in my hands & feet. My Grooming shop isn't going to be going much longer. I am not taking new clients, & only have a hand full of regulars that refuse to go elsewhere, so I go into town once every week or 2 to groom for them.

Dogs I will take on a walk in basis must either be happy, short-coated & just need a bath & nail trim, or MUST conform to some sort of breed standard. Or have the conformation & coat quality to let me MAKE it resemble something with a standard.

I will NOT make your Yorkie-doodle-doo look like a fricken Cocker Spaniel. If we're lucky, I might be able to get it to look like a small schnauzer. Naked Yorkies look like mini bobtailed GSD's with bugged eyes. Completely shaved chows look like Lowland Gorillas. So, if you are WORRIED about what your MUTT looks like when you take it to a groomer, don't blow smoke up our rears & tell us it's a "Rare New Breed". We went to SCHOOL to learn dog breeds, we KNOW better.

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If I had been looking for another breed of dog, say a Golden Retriever or lab, I would search for a breeder who competed in AKC shows or field trials.

And this i just have to disagree with. As the new owner of my 3rd Chesapeake, the breeder we got her from doesn't show or compete in field trials, he HUNTS his dogs. That is more important than any show or field trial in my book, that puts dinner on the table. Now, some of the people who purchase pups from him do compete in show and field trials, but that just doesn't mean much to me. We wanted a dog who was a proven hunter, and based on her behavior at 3 1/2 months old, that's exactly what we got. She's just like my last 2 Chessies.

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Agreed, but what about the guy who breeds 4 litters a year and offloads them on Craig's List for $50, and then those people dump the unsocialized/unfixed dogs at the pound once they get tired of dealing with the animal? It's not necessarily abusive, just poor animal ownership.

In your mind you're right and not a bad person, but some people might think otherwise. There are levels of "bad". Quite honestly, I think it's horrible to breed animals with no real purpose. The whole "I can, and I will, because I wannnnt to" mentality is rather poor reasoning.

I have never been overly concerned with what others think of my decisions. It is me that has to look at me in the mirror and that is what matters to me. I have no shame in the animals that I have produced over the years, dogs, horses and mules.

In my mind the person at fault for dumping an unsocialized/unfixed dog at the pound is the one who dumped it, not the one that bred it (unless they are the same person). Maybe breeders should ensure that the buyer has researched the purchase and has he knowledge necessary to properly care for the animal. A good breeder will do that, I know that I did, as well as provided printed material and training support for the life of the animal. I did this at no additional cost BTW.

We should turn our energy to educating animal owners/potential owners and in encouraging our justice system to prosecute with vigor when abuse/neglect charges are founded. The breeder that abuses/neglects their breeding stock or the results of the breeding should be prosecuted and sentenced with vigor, thus discouraging not only that breeder but others with similar set-ups/intent. The same should go for owners that are guilty of abuse/neglect.

You have really touched on the crux of the unwanted animal population though. Terms such as quality, quantity, abuse, neglect, proper care, adequate housing, etc. are very subjective. What is OK with you may not meet my standards or the other way around. There have been many, many threads on here discussing "proper" horse care but the definition of "proper" has never been agreed upon.

Edited to add that I whole-heartedly agree with farah on this. A show record does not always indicate a quality animal. I like an animal that was bred to do what I want it to do so if I want a working ranch horse, I will go to a ranch that breeds them and can prove the ability and ethics of their stock. That cannot, IMO, be proven in the show pen. Same with my bird dogs. I could care less about a field trial dog, I want to watch the parents hunt where I hunt.

Edited by equinitis

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We have someone in our area that advertises Great Dane/poodles regularly. Now that is a combination with absolutely no purpose other than to create the next "designer" breed. Unfortunately, even with her litters rarely selling out quickly and having to hold on to pups longer, they haven't gotten the hint and continue to breed them. :bang_head:

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We have someone in our area that advertises Great Dane/poodles regularly.

Great Doodles!

Great googly moogly. :blink:

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There are at least four or five pure bred dogs at the local humane society. I don't see the point in breeding. Thousands of dogs die in shelters. I am a huge pit bull lover. I would love to breed a litter one day, and get to raise them properly and socialize them. However, why would I do that when there are pit bull puppies, and lots of other puppies, dying everyday?

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^^ Which is a Wive's Tale. Poodles are not any more hypo allergenic than I am. :rolleye0014:

There were some tests done somewhere a while ago, (I'm old, don't remember the actual University) that disproved that. People are not allergic to the dog HAIR, it's the saliva & dander. Haven't met a dog yet that doesn't have dog spit. There's rumors about Bichons being more of a hypo dog... maybe because they are better bred than the average poodle & have better teeth, so less rotten tooth goo? IDK.

MOST of the Poodle crosses are to create some stupid "Designer" name, & make a few bucks on self-perceived Kyootness. MOSTLY, poodle crosses are nothing other than the Professional Groomer's Worst Nightmares.

As I said, I am getting old, my back hurts, my elbows are shot, my wrists suck, & I have arthritis in my hands & feet. My Grooming shop isn't going to be going much longer. I am not taking new clients, & only have a hand full of regulars that refuse to go elsewhere, so I go into town once every week or 2 to groom for them.

Dogs I will take on a walk in basis must either be happy, short-coated & just need a bath & nail trim, or MUST conform to some sort of breed standard. Or have the conformation & coat quality to let me MAKE it resemble something with a standard.

I will NOT make your Yorkie-doodle-doo look like a fricken Cocker Spaniel. If we're lucky, I might be able to get it to look like a small schnauzer. Naked Yorkies look like mini bobtailed GSD's with bugged eyes. Completely shaved chows look like Lowland Gorillas. So, if you are WORRIED about what your MUTT looks like when you take it to a groomer, don't blow smoke up our rears & tell us it's a "Rare New Breed". We went to SCHOOL to learn dog breeds, we KNOW better.

I think I need to give you 2 of these :notworthy::notworthy: and 1 of these :yahoo:

I absolutely HATE it when people's argument in defense of their dog is, " but the parents are purebred", yeah, they may be, but, they're two DIFFERENT breeds, you moron! And, that makes your Fido, A MUTT!! And, not worth the 500 or 1,000 dollars you paid for it.

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I absolutely HATE it when people's argument in defense of their dog is, " but the parents are purebred", yeah, they may be, but, they're two DIFFERENT breeds, you moron! And, that makes your Fido, A MUTT!! And, not worth the 500 or 1,000 dollars you paid for it.

A BIG FAT DITTO!!!

My neighbors have a husky something or another, not spayed that just had puppies. They keep asking me how many I want (none). They are talking about keeping a female puppy and a male. Ugh I having a feeling there's going to be an abundance of puppies next door. I spent MY time and gas and some money spaying their 2 stray cats (male and female). I did it BECAUSE I don't enjoy a billion stray inbred feral cats peeing and pooping in my yard. There's another male I'm trying to get my hands on. When I do snip snip for him also. Dont get me wrong kittens are ADORABLE!! But I'd rather not have to deal with it. Even though I don't feed them I still would rather get them fixed. Then at least I know the female isn't being bred to death and the kittens aren't being squashed by semis and cars.

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I absolutely HATE it when people's argument in defense of their dog is, " but the parents are purebred", yeah, they may be, but, they're two DIFFERENT breeds, you moron! And, that makes your Fido, A MUTT!! And, not worth the 500 or 1,000 dollars you paid for it.

If it wasn't for people trying to mix it up a little, the Australian Shepard would never have been...Well from America and Not Australia.. and to finally make it to the Westminster.. the border collie, the Blue Heeler.. Jsut to name a few..Just how did you think these breeds came to exist??:confused0024: They just didn't appear.. Even horse breeds came to exist from someone mixing something up with something else.. The American Belgian draft looks nothing like the horses that are the root of their existence..The bull dog used to be a working dog untill someone bred its ability to breath off the planet.. So NOT ALL PURE BREDS are really worth a crap just because they are "CUTE" and have papers.. If people were right in their minds they would mix them back to pits and get a proper BULL DOG..that won't over heat and actually be able to breath and not pass gas...:rolleye0014: .

Sorry Eskie.. :ashamed0002: Tank is just cute but you have to admit the breed is VERY POOR and very expensive due to their health issues...They should have remained true to breeding and still look like a pit bull...and still be able to give birth without a C-section...

AD

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That's a good point, AD... BUT the people that CREATED those herding breeds had a purpose in mind, other than to make another "Doodle" for a few bucks. They could afford to experiment, had plans for the resulting pups, & were not afraid to cull the undesirable results... either by neutering/ rehoming, or outright terminating them, & not repeating that particular failed cross. The "average" person trying to come up with something Kyoot, usually has a limited budget, & an even more limited outlet on where to place the rejects. IF they even bother to test for stuff in the founding breed list of genetic issues. I mean, WHY create something that you KNOW is going to not have a healthy long life? AD, English Bulldogs are a perfect example. My Pug is another.

Heck, my son's hound is a prime example. Beautiful dog, dumb as a box of rocks, & all hound. He HAS to stay tied, because he'll follow his nose & get lost, shot, etc. He is neutered. His sire turned on HIS owner & had to be destroyed by a Sheriff. Copper even LOOKS at my kid crosseyed, & I have a .38 shell with his name on it. The man that created this hound crossed his BEST Bluetick/Treeing walker male with his relative's best female Plott... with the idea that they could put a little more endurance on the B.T./W-X. Worked great. The pups from that litter will run all night. He's having a hard time getting them to differ between a coon & a skunk though. :rolleye0014:

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See I am one of those who would buy a golden doddle. I like both pure breds but prefer the larger size of the cross and that the extreme parts of the temperaments of both breeds seem to be brought down a notch. The golden doodles I have seen make better pets than most of either of the purebred counter parts I have seen. Isnt breeding a great pet a good goal for a dog breeder? Considering how many people buy dogs exclusively as pets it seems like a good enough reason to justify doing it. If I can get a standardized look, temperament, and size that I prefer for a pet dog why shouldnt I be willing to pay as much for a crossbred pup out of two exceptional purebred parents as I would for a pure bred?

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skippitb, because the SAME dog is IN the pound already, waiting for you to find it. I think that was the whole point of this thread, WHY do people breed animals "because they can", & NOT to better the breed, or create a new breed with a purpose other than to look cute.

If I had the time & cash, I would LOVE to create a new breed. My perfect dog would have herding, protection, hunting, fetching, companion, babysitter, trail dog traits, easy to groom, medium size, cute, & heck, he'd fetch my shot glass for me on Friday nights.

Oh crap. I just described my HUSBAND!!! :twitch::rotf:

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skippitb, because the SAME dog is IN the pound already, waiting for you to find it. I think that was the whole point of this thread, WHY do people breed animals "because they can", & NOT to better the breed, or create a new breed with a purpose other than to look cute.

If I had the time & cash, I would LOVE to create a new breed. My perfect dog would have herding, protection, hunting, fetching, companion, babysitter, trail dog traits, easy to groom, medium size, cute, & heck, he'd fetch my shot glass for me on Friday nights.

Oh crap. I just described my HUSBAND!!! :twitch::rotf:

Your a lucky girl. I wish mine would all of that! :winking:

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Sorry Eskie.. :ashamed0002: Tank is just cute but you have to admit the breed is VERY POOR and very expensive due to their health issues...They should have remained true to breeding and still look like a pit bull...and still be able to give birth without a C-section...

AD

I forgive ya, AD.. We love our Tonka truck.. but he is a VERY expensive dog.. and that is not counting the $1500 we paid for him. He had the prolapse in his p.e.n.i.s and had multiple surgeries.. he has allergies to grass.. Thank God he doesn't have breathing problems.

However, I have to say, all my dogs are pretty much from BYB's. Even Paisley. She came from working ranch dogs tho, and is still honestly considered a backyard dog. I have adopted from the shelters, found dogs on the road that owners have never claimed, and purchased from BYB's. I do not believe that with out BYB's (and I am NOT talking puppy mills) many people would not be able to afford a average purebred dog.

My next dog (yes, I am always thinking ahead and I know it will be in MANY years) is going to be a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel. They are smart, friendly and beautiful dogs. I can start saving now to get a pet quality one from a "Show breeder" for about $2500.. or I can get one from a byb pairing for about $800.

And another thing I just wanted to throw out there... many of the posters are talking about before you breed to make sure your dog is "proven".. Well, who is to be the judge of that? Maybe Tonka's sire was proven to be of sound mind and temperament. Maybe that is how he was "proven" to his owners.

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My point is most Westminster dogs have had the "DOG" part of their breeding bred out.. Like Tank, Like RED's Pug, like those tiny little shaky rat dogs people love having in their houses peeing on the floor. Thats not a dog.. A dog does what it is bred to do. It stays a dog.. Think about how many are breeding Chinese crested blends now to get Fugly dogs for a stupid contest...! It is unfortunate that not everyone can afford a 2,500.00 dog..So there will be breeders that produce dogs at a cheaper price.

When I send out Coco and Indy in the woods they circle out and then come in from the side..never the front or back of me.. If something was chasing them, they circle instead of running towards you, staying away from the aggressor by facing them head on..They are herd protectors, hunters , and family pets and super sweet , very loyal and very smart to the part of problem solving.. They are equal in smarts I feel to the Border Collie..Its why I bred mine. They are true to their breeding and have proved that they are..

My pups have been the same as their mom and dad and everyone that has gotten one can't beleive they have never heard of them before being an old American breed that was careful bred to be a specific type physically and mentally.. I did get one complaint from an owner of the last litter... His merle female started out rattling the door knob to ask to get out.. Now she just opens the door by the knob anytime she wants out or in the house.. The problem.. she just hasn't gotten the idea the door needs to be closed again..and the house is filling up with bugs!:thud: I can't imagine what she will be like as an older dog.. she is only 4 months old come the 5th of July. I hope she figures the door thing out...:lol:

If I want to breed my animals, I will. If I want to make money breeding my animals, that does not make me a bad person OR say that I am not doing it "right" because I am making a profit.

THIS^^^^^^

AD

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I get the point that without the 'lower' quality of breeders or simply working stock dog breeders, dogs could be super expensive, but trust me, the United States could very easily cut out half of these breeders, and still have an overpopulation. There is really not a whole lot that one can do. If one wants to breed their dogs, they will. I am a huge pit bull lover and would love to be able to breed them, but there are so many BYBs and crappy breeders, that I never will. I do not want to contribute to the overpopulation of any dog breed.

There are some people that live her in Indiana that I have saw on Facebook. They are the worst kind of breeders. They breed anything and everything just for a profit. They claim they aren't in it for the money, but what else would make someone breed weird crosses left and right? They can't even punctuate or spell properly. I'm sorry, but everything about them screams dumb.. PM me for link :)

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My husband keeps saying he wants to breed our German shepherd but I keep telling him no not until she gets her hips and whatever else needs done tested before hand. I've had SEVERAL chances to breed her to pure bred American shepherds (she's imported from Germany) but I've passed. If I breed her it will be to another import with a pedigree to compliment mine. I've also got to see if her ear thing is hereditary if so no puppies out of her. We watch her close for her heat cycles and take proper precautions to ensure she doesn't have puppies. We've done a great job being she hasn't had a single litter and she's 3. Would I like to breed her? I dunno every single thing has to be in line before that decision could be made. Is she a show dog? Nope. But she has the potential. I just know nothing about show and no time or money to try.

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I have to disagree that a horse without a pedigree won't fetch all that much. Maybe not as much as you put into it...but when it comes time to sell, there will be someone out there who will want your well trained "mutt" horse. Our Jubilee was a mutt horse, a PMU filly. She was gorgeous, and fairly well built...had an extremely sound mind and was very trainable. We never did take her to a trainer...but we did train her over time and with the help of an instructor, got her pretty consistent in her w/t/c, on trails, etc. Sold her for $3900 last June. Not impossible.

All of my kitties are definitely fixed. Our humane shelter runs a clinic every spring and fall and it's pretty inexpensive to do it that way.

When I was a kid, we didn't fix our cats. It wasn't that we couldn't afford it, we just kind of let it slip. Irresponsible? Yep. But the difference between getting a cat from a shelter and getting a cat from us is that our cats were all extremely well socialized with children and other animals, had hunting experience, were litter box trained, and had great personalities. We never once had a problem giving the kittens away. We always knew who the daddy was...a Blue Russian came around every spring and did the deed...he was the nicest cat. Most of our kittens were given away long before they were ready to go home. So we did not do it on purpose but we didn't prevent it either. Just saw no reason to. We gave them away to friends and family who we knew would fix them and get them their shots...occasionally to other homes but we made sure they were good homes.

I don't agree with breeding mutts on purpose except in very personal situations. I don't agree with selling mixed breed dogs...anyone can go to a shelter and pick one out that's already fixed, got its shots, etc. and pay the same amount. And there are tons of great dogs free in the paper that would do just as well.

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My next dog (yes, I am always thinking ahead and I know it will be in MANY years) is going to be a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel. They are smart, friendly and beautiful dogs. I can start saving now to get a pet quality one from a "Show breeder" for about $2500.. or I can get one from a byb pairing for about $800.

My sister had a Cavalier. Super awesome dog. She got him from the neighbor when their house burnt. I would totally own one of those. Our next dog is going to be a cocker spaniel. Hubby and I grew up with them and would love to have another.

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very interesting thread and responses.

for those of you who have bred or are considering breeding let me ask you this: how "picky" are you when it comes to prospective buyers? what questions would you or do ask? please allow to me to tell you why i'm asking.

i am going to be driving 9 1/2 hours next week(i'm in bavaria and he's in germany close to the dutch border) to pick up a dog that i will be fostering. he's apparently a lovely 1 year (uncastrated :bang_head: ) old bc/aussie mix. the family is looking for a new home for him, because they have 6 year old twin boys and an 8 year old boy, work full time job and have come to realize that this life is no life for THIS DOG. how could this happen? first time dog owners; guess that breeder didn't ask the right questions or didn't ask the questions right. an octopus could have predicted the probable outcome.

they're lovely people and clearly want the best for the dog, but no breeder who would want the best for all parties would have sold (:bang_head:) him to people like this in the first place if they had known the probable outcome or if they had CARED.

my friend in the south of france who breeds ridgebacks who are sold all over the world before they are even concieved demands that even if you are in timbuktu or tahiti and want one of her pups you have to go to and meet her. it's not BREEDING dogs that's such a problem, it's how conscientious the breeder is about who gets the pup.

she charges A LOT, with reason. she puts money, time and love into raising these guys, and she doesn't sell them to "just anybody". she has a reputation, also with reason. dogs on Ebay? :mad: but i guess joe public is just too dumb to know any better. "always a reason but never an excuse".

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very interesting thread and responses.

for those of you who have bred or are considering breeding let me ask you this: how "picky" are you when it comes to prospective buyers? what questions would you or do ask? please allow to me to tell you why i'm asking.

Let's say Meshia had all her tests done, her ear problem isn't heretitary and I find a male who's going to compliment her pedigree and make a quality offspring. I'd probably make the prospective buyers sign a contract to spay and neuter the puppies. I'd have them provide proof. If its a show home I'd ask for proof. Joe blow isn't walking out of my yard with a puppy just cause they have cash in hand. To many people do that. JMHO

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nick.. ever heard of liars?

Maybe the breeder "did" ask.. and the people assured them that the dog was going to have plenty of exercise.. and maybe, just maybe, the people had great intentions.. who knows for sure.

I have had several litters over the past 20 years, and heard a lot of people say a lot of things..

All the pups I have sold have been de-wormed, have had first shots. They go home with a bag of puppy food, a brochure about the breed and info on house breaking, treats, a toy, puppy pads. They have been socialized and exposed to kids, cats, other dogs. I have taken back pups that people were no longer able to care for.

I haven't had a dog have a litter in a few years, and who knows if I will again. But not all byb's are horrible people.

AD.. I am going to have to disagree with you. Just because you don't see a need or reason for a "rat" dog, doesn't mean there isn't one. I love our Chihuahua with all my heart. She is an excellent companion. They are companion animals and she excels at it. (on and BTW.. it's TONKA.. not tank.. :) )

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<snip>

Under normal circumstances I say spay or neuter, and my house pets are fixed, but I can't stand when people want to make everyone conform to the same cut in stone rules. Same goes with ranch horses, may not be shown in an arena, but heck if they aren't proven enough to continue their lines...

JMHO

But if they are proven on the ranch or for hunting they are proven to be worthy to continue the lines ... IF they are health tested for genetic breed specific problems

People that abuse animals should go to jail. That abuse includes dumping unwanted animals to fend for themselves.

The answer to the unwanted, animals and people, lies not in controlling breeding but in punishing/correcting abuse and neglect.

Period. The End.

If I want to breed my animals, I will. If I want to make money breeding my animals, that does not make me a bad person OR say that I am not doing it "right" because I am making a profit.

Yes ... and if you breed genetically poor animals who produce offspring with severe health problems you are not any better than an abuser ... Not only are those animals often in pain their entire life, they are also sold cheaply to people who often can't afford the vet care they need.

There are at least four or five pure bred dogs at the local humane society. I don't see the point in breeding. Thousands of dogs die in shelters. I am a huge pit bull lover. I would love to breed a litter one day, and get to raise them properly and socialize them. However, why would I do that when there are pit bull puppies, and lots of other puppies, dying everyday?

The purebred dogs in shelters don't have OFA or SERF testings, no one knows about the temperament of the parents or to what level a young dog might be suited to work. If I want a working dog, be it a hunter, farm dog, conformation dog, or K9 I get the dog that is most suited for the job I have in mind. At least I couldn't afford to have a pack of dogs to take care of in order to maybe get one to work with.

I get the point that without the 'lower' quality of breeders or simply working stock dog breeders, dogs could be super expensive, but trust me, the United States could very easily cut out half of these breeders, and still have an overpopulation. <snip>

This is not true Read this article "as many as 300,000 puppies a year ? most from countries with little or no health safeguards, are being imported to satisfy the demand for puppies at shelters"

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Hast- If you are wanting a working dog, I see not getting one from the shelter. You don't know very much about them. I guess I'm aiming my view at people looking for an everyday pet to be part of the family. A lot of the dogs in my area are owners surrenders. A lot of people moving and what not. When a dog is surrendered, they try to find out as much information as possible on them.

In this smaller town area, I don't see many working dogs.

And really, who would import dogs to be put in shelters??? That's wrong on so many levels. That is not how it goes around here. And I don't support the HSUS. I support the local humane society and animal control, as well as pit bull rescues.

When they are importing those puppies, what are they doing with all of the other dogs that don't have homes?

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Jetty, it is actually pretty common. The shelter we got my parents dog from brought in puppies from all over to meet the demand. The area where the shelter is was well off, so anybody that wasn't actively breeding had their pet fixed-meaning there weren't a lot of puppies around. Our pup came from a kill shelter in Georgia, and I know they also worked with a place in SC, plus they imported from Puerto Rico. They had a fast turnover, and very few adult dogs (mostly greyhounds from their track affiliation and a few mutts and the occasional pit).

When we were there (early January) there were 2 greyhounds, 1 mutt who was under behavior evaluation(had been in a foster home, but had bit), 1 boxer/pb mix, and 3 litters of puppies from Georgia. In this case it was a no kill shelter-so they weren't taking homes from any other dog really-people who want a puppy oftentimes won't take an older dog, so they saved these ones from a gas chamber and brought them to a place where there was a chance for them to find a home. I see a lot of "trading" between kill shelters and no kills, if there is a nice adoptable animal at a kill shelter they seem to try and find it a place at a no kill. As for the less adoptables-no kills choose not to take them out of space limits and they have their couple of weeks at a kill shelter before being euthed.

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<snip>

And really, who would import dogs to be put in shelters??? That's wrong on so many levels. That is not how it goes around here. <snip>

Read the article and think about what you know about the dogs that come to the shelter. If 300,000 puppies with questionable background and mentality are imported to the US ... where do they all end up? That's just puppies ... What about adding in adult dogs with as unknown nerves and mentality? Do you think they all have a home when they arrive? Where do you think they all go if they don't ? Do you really think they all find loving forever homes and no, or maybe just a few, are surrendered to a shelter?

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Sorry Eskie..:happy0203: Tank is my nephews Bull dog that is restricted to staying inside due to his breathing problems even after a few operations on his nose...and rat dogs.. I have a dislike because my sister in law, (whos dog went with her everywhere and was brought into your home so the lil jerk could crap in your shoes and pee all over the place...)my good friend and another horse person I know have them, both breed them, both have dog poop on their front door porches and in their homes..."It don't hurt things, its tiny" :rolleye0014: YUK! Plus they are tea cups and have med problems.... I rather have a working dog I guess.. When I went through my little doggy cuddle days I had two poms...I had rotties before that.. Never will I have another small dog..never... I might consider a Schipperke since they have brains and are a big dog in a little package..PLUS they eat vermin! Its like having a cat and dog in the same package.. I like Min Pins too, but would stay clear of a breeder that breeds the ones that look like Chihuahua's ...The ones that actually look like Pincher are a much better dog..Hubby wants one after the St. Bernard.. If you like little dogs..more power to you.. I don't and never will..

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Jetty, it is actually pretty common. The shelter we got my parents dog from brought in puppies from all over to meet the demand. The area where the shelter is was well off, so anybody that wasn't actively breeding had their pet fixed-meaning there weren't a lot of puppies around. Our pup came from a kill shelter in Georgia, and I know they also worked with a place in SC, plus they imported from Puerto Rico. They had a fast turnover, and very few adult dogs (mostly greyhounds from their track affiliation and a few mutts and the occasional pit).

When we were there (early January) there were 2 greyhounds, 1 mutt who was under behavior evaluation(had been in a foster home, but had bit), 1 boxer/pb mix, and 3 litters of puppies from Georgia. In this case it was a no kill shelter-so they weren't taking homes from any other dog really-people who want a puppy oftentimes won't take an older dog, so they saved these ones from a gas chamber and brought them to a place where there was a chance for them to find a home. I see a lot of "trading" between kill shelters and no kills, if there is a nice adoptable animal at a kill shelter they seem to try and find it a place at a no kill. As for the less adoptables-no kills choose not to take them out of space limits and they have their couple of weeks at a kill shelter before being euthed.

I had no idea.. Well around here I know where almost every dog came from. Not from the original breeder, but they are not being imported directly for our shelter. I heard that along the east coast there are spay/neuter laws, so there aren't as many unwanted pets. Some of the pets from our shelter when on a transport to some of the east coasts no kill shelters. The local shelters that I deal with are no kill.

Our shelter has pulled from no-kill shelters. That is why I have my current Dogue de Bordeaux foster. The owners were going to dump him at a very high kill shelter, so I stepped up to foster through the no-kill shelter.

The high kill shelter that I'm talking about only holds for a few days. They make trips multiple times a week to euthanize. They do nothing to try to find the dogs or cats homes. It's even been reported that people have offered to take an animal, if they would hold it for a few days, but the shelter did not. They took the animal to be euthanized instead.

I'm saying that if more transport options were out there, there would be no need to import dogs or puppies. There are areas that have a huge overpopulation that could be transported to the areas that don't.

Thanks for the new information.

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